Potential Giants Free-Agent Target: Quincy Black, OLB, Buccaneers

by Ed Valentine on Jul 14, 2011 10:00 AM EDT in New York Giants News

It seems we have spent a lot of time recently discussing potential free-agent linebackers to see how they might fit with the New York Giants. In a recent post a commenter asked for an in-depth look at Tampa Bay Buccaneers outside linebacker Quincy Black. So, here is it.

Black is a four-year veteran who has started on the strong side for Tampa Bay the past two seasons. Just 27, he could be an unrestricted free agent if the league reverts back to 2009 free agency rules.

Pewter Report referred to Black as "a young, ascending player that has his best football ahead of him."

Last season, Black was on pace to have his best year before a broken forearm ended his season in Week 14. He totaled 88 tackles with four tackles for a loss, two sacks, one interception, one forced fumble, and one fumble recovery. Black also missed two other games due to an ankle injury. If Black had stayed healthy he likely would have been the team’s second- or third-best tacklers for the season. Buccaneers head coach and defensive coordinator Raheem Morris added a 3-4 defense and 3-3-5 defense and used less nickel packages in part to keep Black on the field for all three downs and use him as a pass rusher.

Walter Football said "Black did a great job as Tampa Bay's two-down strongside linebacker in 2010."

Bucs Nation, SB Nation's Tampa Bay website, seems to think that Black is a good, but 'replaceable' player for the Buccaneers.

In previous stories, I've talked about Quincy Black as a replaceable player, because I did not see much of a dropoff from Black to rookie Dekoda Watson and veteran backup Adam Hayward. But a lot of people disagree with my take, and see Quincy Black as a star. Pro Football Focus consistently touts him as one of the best 4-3 LBs in the NFL, and Matt Williamson of ESPN's Scouts Inc. has praised him as well.

Quincy Black has not been a special player on the field these past seasons. He's been solid, perhaps, but he hasn't made many splash plays. He's weakest in coverage, but probably the Bucs' most consistent linebacker against the run. Unlike the other linebackers, he can occasionally shed blocks and there's a bit of a pop to his tackles. He's been used as a pass rusher by the Bucs, though with little success. What stands about Quincy Black more than anything, though, is his athletic ability. He's 27, but he has a lot of upside left at least in terms of physical potential.

Pro Football Focus does, indeed, like Black's work. In 2010, Black ranked 12th among linebackers who played at least 25 percent of a team's snaps, with a +8.0 rating. His numbers were positive across the board. For comparison, Keith Bulluck was +8.7 in limited duty and Michael Boley was +7.8. In 2009, Black was +7.1 and Bulluck (then with Tennessee) was +6.9.

PFF lists Black 44th among its top 51 free agents.

Black isn’t exactly a game changer, but he’s a solid hand and teams need those guy of guys. Good enough to play on every down, you’ll need playmakers around him but no need to worry about him letting the side down.

For Football Outsiders fans, Black had a 2010 stop rate of 60 percent -- meaning 60 percent of plays in which he was targeted were considered stops, or unsuccessful plays for the offense.

Could Black be a younger version of Bulluck -- or become Bulluck when he was in his prime with Tennessee? PFF shows them as comparable, but that is really hard to judge.

Your thoughts?

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Comments

If the price is right I wouldnt mind the signing

He would def upgrade our LB’s. But he def isnt a game changer, just a solid player so I certainly wouldnt spend big money on him. Once again, I would rather spend money to solidify our OL.

Some people think football is a matter of life and death. I assure you, it's much more serious than that."

by Giants56 on Jul 14, 2011 10:34 AM EDT reply actions

Sounds like the SLB version of Michael Boley

if he’s cheap, OK. If not, no. And cheap would be $1-1.5mil/year. Over that, hell no.

Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows

by Rorschach44 on Jul 14, 2011 10:38 AM EDT reply actions

by SLB version you mean?

he’s good against the run but not the pass, where Boley is essentially the opposite playing the weak side?

by Matt dubs on Jul 14, 2011 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions

that he plays SLB

and PFF says he’s one of the best LBs in the league

Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows

by Rorschach44 on Jul 14, 2011 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions

Boley is not as bad against the run as it may seem

Osi doesnt keep the WLB clean most of the time, most WLB cannot take on O linemen consistently, and if they can, then there is something seriously wrong with the O linemen that they are playing.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 14, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions

if boley, goff and bullock played so well last year then how did our LBers suck?

The general consensus is that the LB crew was the weak spot of our D last year… except when you speak about players individually everyone praises Goff and Boley, and Bullock rated very well by PFF…. so whats the problem?

by Matt dubs on Jul 14, 2011 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions

there isn't one?

the biggest problem is these guys are on the field too much. Why? We can’t sustain drives on offense. Why? No Steve Smith.

Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows

by Rorschach44 on Jul 14, 2011 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions

No

No way anyone can say our linebacke play – as a unit – was any more than medicre and quite often, sub par.

Bad LB play was due to average players, much less so that the O’s lack of sustained drives.

Bring lawyers, guns and money to get me out of this one! Stand in the Fire.

by MSP Giant on Jul 14, 2011 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions

I've been saying it since 2009

the running game’s been sub par. They rattle off long gains for most of their yardage, then less then 3 yards per carry.

The defensive line is on the field too much, and even with our depth and talent it gets taxed. Then this hurts the LBzers, who do fine when the DL is fresh enough to do their jobs.

The LBs don’t have a star player, so its easy for people to point out the flaws cuz they don’t have to go out of their way to do so. But their average players, and that’s all you need to have a great defense (see 2007).

Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows

by Rorschach44 on Jul 15, 2011 9:25 AM EDT up reply actions

AP was well above average.

(see 2007)

Just get it done already...

by tommy d. on Jul 16, 2011 7:47 PM EDT up reply actions

Actually,

I don’t mean to nit-pick your statement with my AP comment. Overall I totally agree with your assessment that with a dominating Dline and a very good secondary can in many instances negate the need for impact LB’s.

Just get it done already...

by tommy d. on Jul 16, 2011 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions

There is no problem

The thing is people want to ignore turnovers and badly executed defensive calls that were actually perfect for the situation. So when all else fails blame the LB’s, but they were pretty solid. People just want to see one name out there all the time, all the substitutions threw people off and made them feel lik the LB core was not good at all and thats BS.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 15, 2011 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions

No one ignores the turnovers

Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows

by Rorschach44 on Jul 15, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions

Yes they do

there is no real tangible fix to turnovers in an offseason, you might want to say cut the players with the most turnovers but that would be cutting all of our good players. what s the next best thing?? blame something else…..people are around here complaining about LB’s, like are u kidding me.

Like i said, the sam position is responsible for runs mainly, we were a hell of a run stopping team. so in actuality was the Sam position really a liability?? where are the defensive stats that say we NEED a LB??…. yes we need a defined starter but lets not act like the position is in shambles and giving up big plays.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 15, 2011 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions

I can't see anyone ignoring turnovers

only thing I see is you talking about people ignoring turnovers. I haven’t hurt one person saying that the turnovers were no big deal last year.

Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows

by Rorschach44 on Jul 15, 2011 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions

Well what have you heard people saying was the big deal last year???

Cause all i have heard about is OL and LB’s….two positions that didnt cause us to lose games at an alarming rate. I havent really seen anything about turnovers actually, all i hear about is roster turnover at SAM and C.

Not saying i want to sit here and talk about T.O’s all day either.

Oh yea by the way, i was actually on your side if you were reading. we are both saying the LB’ers are not to blame. You said the DL is on the field too much, well why do you think that is??? TURNOVERS.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 18, 2011 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions

last year the big deal was turnovers

when it came to the draft and FAs, its teh Lbaneezers and OLs.

But the problem last year? Pretty sure 99% of us said turnovers was a big problem.

Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows

by Rorschach44 on Jul 19, 2011 9:46 AM EDT up reply actions

I think its SAM and C

Two positions, which were NOT “problems” at all last year, check the running game and check the run stopping game……. it would be nice to get one name playing those positions all year so that you guys dont continue to blow this “LB” and “OL” thing out of proportion.

but i hear u 44.

When it comes to FA and the Draft, i actually think TE and FB were the only sketchy positions i would consider a problem other than that BPA all day and thats what we did.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 22, 2011 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions

espys

anyone see the “best game” hopefully not bc it was trash. desean’s hoodrat speech on stage was about as entertaining as the minimal claps received from the audience.

by GiantBeing on Jul 14, 2011 11:14 AM EDT reply actions

i know it doesn't qualify for this year

but the US women vs. Brazil was definitely the best game I’ve seen in a long time.

Of course that is if there is a season.

by Flynner on Jul 14, 2011 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions

I wish I coulda seen that

Just get it done already...

by tommy d. on Jul 16, 2011 7:55 PM EDT up reply actions

I didnt know this guy was a FA

Young, Athletic, and a 3 down backer…hmmm need we know more….hell to the no…I would def. target this guy over Rocky, Poz, and them.

by Bavaro 89 on Jul 14, 2011 11:27 AM EDT reply actions

Quincy Black is not going anywhere

Him and Mason Foster are their future…..Tampa Bay has quietly built and awesome front seven if the players play up to their potential.

Clayborn, Bowers(if healthy), Price, McCoy, Rudd, Foster, black…. damn that could be lethal.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 14, 2011 11:32 AM EDT reply actions

If he is an FA

then he has a choice. He may choose to go with a winner, that would be the Giants.

In all of the FA discussions, have to consider the lockout impact on new players. The longer the waste of time, the less likely that teams like the Giants will make FA moves.

That said, seems like a decent choice, give it a try.

I hope Austin works out because if not, I’m gonna be mad that we passed up Foster. I know JReese cares about what I think.

All the Giants should play like Mark Bavaro.
Tom Quinn Must Go!
On second thought, let's not blame players or coaches, they are not responsible. The unsupportive fans are to blame.

by UnknownJintsFan on Jul 14, 2011 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions

choice....yes...

The Bucs also went 10-6 last year and their division seems to be easier to win than the East… he may be focused on staying in TB, not to mention the tax break, plus they will be able to make a more attractive offer than the NYG… So in conclusion; possibly more money… the ability to retain more of the money and Florida in December over New York in December….and the perks of playing against the NFC South vs the East…. I wonder if he even returns Jerry’s Call.

Some people think football is a matter of life and death. I don't like that attitude. I can assure them it is much more serious than that.

by njsoldier1978 on Jul 14, 2011 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions

good points, esp. the tax breaks

But I’d say that the level of competition is about the same.
Eggs =Saints
NY=ATL
Bucs=Pokes
Wash=Car

by Last year in Sec 127 on Jul 15, 2011 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions

I would agree that there are the same number of teams there, but 1-4 i believe the East is better… I know, just a belief, but I stand strong behind it.

Some people think football is a matter of life and death. I don't like that attitude. I can assure them it is much more serious than that.

by njsoldier1978 on Jul 15, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions

I think The players in Tampa Bay

would consider themselves winners already. I dont see him viewing the Giants as that much of an upgrade from where he is. Of course we do but we are Giants fans but last i checked there was no difference in between the two teams records, that would lead me to believe he thinks the Giants are not really in a better space than his current team.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 15, 2011 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions

+1

I live in Bucs country… The only player the Bucs are content to let leave is Rudd… Quincy Black is considered their Superstar on Defense.

The Bucs also consider themselves superbowl contenders… With Freeman leading the way… and frankly I believe it too.. Black aint goin nowhere.

by Skii31 on Jul 15, 2011 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions

Thanks Ed!!!!

You are truly a man of the people :)

Big Blue Through and Through

by AussieGiant on Jul 14, 2011 12:16 PM EDT via mobile reply actions

Of the FA LBs he sounds best

But I still wonder if it’s a big upgrade over what we have. Plus no matter how much people hate it, the 3 WR sets are pushing LBs off the field. Any LB they sign will most likely be a 2 down guy. That’s especially true if Sash, Prince and Ross are fit (makes the nickels and dimes more appealing)

Plus Kiwi could steal some time.

by trueblue63 on Jul 14, 2011 1:30 PM EDT reply actions

am I taking crazy pills?

(via Ed in the Keith Bulluck Wants What the Giants are unlikely to give)
Boley was +7.8 in 2010 (13th in the league at 4-3 OLB), but -6.7 in 2009 (46th in the league)
http://www.bigblueview.com/2011/7/11/2270025/keith-bulluck-wants-what-the-giants-are-unlikely-to-give-nfl-free-agency#comments

(above)
Pro Football Focus does, indeed, like Black’s work. In 2010, Black ranked 12th among linebackers who played at least 25 percent of a team’s snaps, with a +8.0 rating. His numbers were positive across the board. For comparison, Keith Bulluck was +8.7 in limited duty and Michael Boley was +7.8. In 2009, Black was +7.1 and Bulluck (then with Tennessee) was +6.9.

So….which year was Boley ranked in the Positive?!?!…b/c if it was this year i’m really going to dismiss these knuckleheads….

FIX IT

by andiamo708 on Jul 14, 2011 2:28 PM EDT reply actions

Tough punctuation to read

“For comparison, Keith Bulluck was +8.7 in limited duty and Michael Boley was +7.8.

In 2009, Black was +7.1 and Bulluck (then with Tennessee) was +6.9."

We don't play for the wild card around here kid

by Jaybat on Jul 14, 2011 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions

well clearly Boley had a +7.8 rating

i just wanna know what year it was….’09 or ’10.

the smart money says ’09….

FIX IT

by andiamo708 on Jul 14, 2011 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions

and if that's the case....

where is the evidence to support keeping Boley on the strong side?

FIX IT

by andiamo708 on Jul 14, 2011 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions

He was only on the strong side in base.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 15, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions

well

I don’t understand why he’s playing there, but it is what it is i guess.

FIX IT

by andiamo708 on Jul 15, 2011 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions

Fewell likes the more athletic LB's who are normally the Wil's

to be on the strong side so they can hopefully use their athleticism to better guard against TE"s like witten who can destroy the typically bulky Sam backer in space.

It actually makes sense until the opposing team audibles to a run lol.

Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!

Skydiving?Forgot your parachute? TUCK AND ROLLE! On fire? TUCK AND ROLLE Got shot? TUCK AND ROLLE Lost your car keys? TUCK AND ROLLE Failed that history test? TUCK AND ROLLE.

by Blue Gates on Jul 15, 2011 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions

Boley

2010 — +7.8
2009 — -6.7
Gee, I never wrote a bad sentence before. LOL!

by Ed Valentine on Jul 14, 2011 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions

ahhh, i see it now

FIX IT

by andiamo708 on Jul 14, 2011 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions

unfortunately

I think we need a strongside linebacker who can guard against the short pass to the tight end, not a run-stopper. If I was our opponents, game-planning against the Giants defence with the top-notch defensive line and secondary that we have, the obvious tactic would be a quick throw before our pass rush can get to the quarterback. We have to face Cooley, Witten, Celek, Finley and Hernandez/Gronkowski this year, so I hope we don’t get burned by them. Does anyone have more info on how well we did against tight ends last season, was it Grant doing most of that coverage?

Surprised also about our linebacker ratings, especially Bullock. Do PFF give points for making a tackle, regardless of where it was made and how slow the linebacker reacted?

by XYU on Jul 14, 2011 3:12 PM EDT reply actions

Points are given/deducted based on how successful (or unsuccessful) the play was

by Charles L on Jul 14, 2011 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions

I dunno why everyone thinks Boley is bad

From what I saw of the games the past couple years, he wasn’t spectacular, but he was easily the most solid linebacker on our squad and made a good number of plays.

Personally, I think a lot of BBV overrates Goff and underrates Boley. Maybe its because of expectations. I know Boley hasn’t met expectations, but he certainly hasn’t disappointed me. And while I think Goff exceeded expectations of this year, if you compare the two, Boley >>>>>>> Goff IMO.

I agree with whoever says move Boley to the weakside, because that’s where he needs to be. He should NOT be lining up behind Osi. He should be behind Tuck. Goff needs to move to the strongside, and Stephen Tulloch needs to be in the middle :)

Get Better, Not Bitter.

by BigBlueIntervention on Jul 14, 2011 3:31 PM EDT reply actions

Boley isn't bad

he is just inconsistent.

He had great games just like he had very very bad games. That’s why fans are upset IMO

New York Giants French blog http://nygiantsfr.wordpress.com/ (with croissants and wine)

by Thiergow on Jul 14, 2011 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions

I like Boley

I’m not sure we can just rotate em around, I think you could partly solve it by playing JPP on first down, but we know that Osi isn’t ready for the John Abraham role.

by trueblue63 on Jul 14, 2011 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions

Boley is not bad

He is just not really good. He is pretty ordinary.

Problem is, he is the best the Giants have.

Giants LB core needs help. Throw most of the bums out (KB, GW, CB) and try some young guys (Dillard, Greg Jones). I guess it could get worse but it would be more fun to watch with guys flying all over the field.

Bring lawyers, guns and money to get me out of this one! Stand in the Fire.

by MSP Giant on Jul 14, 2011 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions

Barrett Ruud

I was listening to Pat Kirwan (I think) a few weeks ago on Sirus NFL Radio and a Giants fan called up asking about the MLB situation. Pat said that there were three guys the Giants should really try and get: Barrett Ruud, Paul Poslusny, and some other guy whos name I forgot. Pat said that Ruud would help out trememdously in the passing game where the Giants are weak, over the middle. It would also ease up the burden on Rolle. What are the odds of us landing him and is he even a possibility? Is he even a free-agent, restricted or not?

Also, how long after a deal is struck do you think training camp would start for the Giants? I’m thinking of flying up there watching a few days cause its in Jersey this year.

To err is human.
To forgive is divine.
Neither is Marine Corps Policy.

by Big Blue in tx on Jul 14, 2011 4:38 PM EDT reply actions

Not a good Idea

I live in Tampa and everyone is already content with letting him walk… He is a Goff clone, but with less upside.

I like Goff and with Adrian Tracy (Hoping he remains healthy), Boley and the Rookies, I believe we have an above avg group of Linebackers…. I dont think its even worth it to try and grab Rudd.

by Skii31 on Jul 15, 2011 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions

never heard of the kid but doesnt sound bad at all

by G'Baby on Jul 14, 2011 5:59 PM EDT reply actions

I think

this all comes down to where exactly the Giants want to improve their LB corps. Do they want a new MLB, so they can move Goff to SAM? Do they want a new SAM and have Goff stay in the middle? Or do they just stick with what they have and hope someone on the roster steps up to take either job?

IMO, if they want to go the route of getting a new SAM, then this is the guy I’d target. He’s young, cheap, and getting better each year. I’ve made it known that I’d like to see the Giants try to bring in more under-the-radar-type players instead of outbidding everyone for the biggest name at a position. And given the cap situation we could be in, we may not be able to afford some of the big names this year anyway.

I think Black could come in and be at least a solid starter, if not more.

The NFL and NFLPA? They can kiss my ass, OK? They can line up and kiss my ass.

by BigBlue21 on Jul 14, 2011 7:48 PM EDT reply actions

And another thing

This team doesn’t need a big name anywhere. They just need a few role players to fill out the depth chart, and produce a capable starter or two through free agency and/or the draft.

The NFL and NFLPA? They can kiss my ass, OK? They can line up and kiss my ass.

by BigBlue21 on Jul 14, 2011 7:56 PM EDT reply actions