Critiquing NFC East WR Tandems
Given the immense talent at WR in our division (sorry skins fans), what are your comments about the following duos:
1. Hakeem Nicks/Mario Manningham
2. DeSean Jackson/Jeremy Maclin
4. Santana Moss/(anyone on skins depth)
Also, rank the top 8 WRs given the tandems. In my case here we go:
1) Hakeem Nicks - huge star-studded WR in the making. Flourishing in the Big Apple under the wings of Eli.
2) DeSean Jackson - the word explosive doesn't even scratch the surface for this tiny little sea creature.
3) Dez Bryant - this is where I will get heat (over Manningham) but yes, Dez is Hakeem's mirror image imo.
4) Miles Austin - A-Rod look-alike gets number 4 due to solid catching ability and route running/experience.
5) Mario Manningham - Took over as solid #2 last year highlighted by several TDs against the Eagles.
6) Jeremy Maclin - dependable WR when needed. Vick's most comfortable target.
7) Santana & Redskins co. - formality.
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sorry
No matter how much I want mm to be > maclin they’re not even close.
Ilya Kovalchuk is good at hockey
by 3 already on Jul 11, 2011 12:12 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
er....
Steve Smith not being our #2 is a joke. Put him in there and that justifies the #1 spot, not Manningham.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
1) Nicks
2) Maclin
3) Dez Bryant (more for potential’s sake)
4) Jackson
5) Santana Moss
6) Steve Smith
7) Mario Manningham
8) Austin
9) Jason Avant
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
by Rorschach44 on Jul 11, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Dez Bryant must do on the field
What we all think he can do before you put him over Jackson, Smith, Austin or Moss ( guys that have been to the pro bowl) 561 total NFL yards is not good enough.
Avant is just another guy
by Late for Dinner on Jul 13, 2011 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions
the Pro Bowl doesnt' count
not when Diehl and Brandon Merriweather make it every year. Bryant just hasn’t done it over multiple years, but he showed that he’s more then capable. Jackson and Austin get too much of their numbers on crossing routes and their mobile QBs buying time. Bryant has Jackson’s speed and Nicks’ size, I’d take him over all those buy Nicks and Maclin, so there.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
WHAT?!?!
Bryant has Jackson’s speed???? Not even close! Jackson ran a 4.29 and Bryant ran a 4.52. Bryant has had 1 year in the NFL and got hurt in that year. You CANT put him ahead of PROVEN talent. For all we know Bryant could blow out his knee in the preseason and never play again. His potential is amazing but we have to give him time to pan out.
40 time is irrelevant
Bryant breaks away from everyone when he gets the ball. I could care less abotu the 40, its absolutely meaningless here.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
Tiers are better than pure rankings
1) Nicks / Austin / Maclin
2) Jackson / Bryant (Potential)
3) Moss / Smith (Injured)
4) Manningham
5) Avant
To each his own
I ranked them within the tiers, so tis really the same thing.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
Maclin over MM
and as an overall WR, which includes things like route running, I would probably take Dez over Jackson
Ranking the NFC East WR's
is a tough task. There is so much comparable talent without a clear standout at #1, IMO. There is no Larry Fitz or Andre Johnson in our division. Quite honestly, if someone put Austin, DJack, or Maclin first I wouldn’t blink at any of those selections.
And Moss being last just shows you how good a crop of wideouts we do have in our division. I suppose he’s that far down due to age and his career arrow pointing down?
I’ll rank them this way:
1. Nicks
2. Maclin
3. DJack
4. Austin
5. Ham
6. Dez
7. Santana
Just get it done already...
I’ll let the Nicks over DJax thing slide because at least there’s an argument there… But Manningham over Maclin? No.
http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/ - Eagles
http://bloggingthebeast.com/ - NFC East
there's no argument
NY Nicks is the better receiver.
Yes, I am a Giants fan. Now that we got that out of the way....
IMPEACH DOLAN!!!!
I will not - lose! -Jay Z-
can't take credit
saw it on here from someone a long time ago, been rocking wit it ever since. btw, ‘Nick Name’. i see what you did there.
Yes, I am a Giants fan. Now that we got that out of the way....
IMPEACH DOLAN!!!!
I will not - lose! -Jay Z-
somebody on the espn message boards kept going with
OPTINICKS PRIME!
I sorta like that one haha
Get Better, Not Bitter.
by BigBlueIntervention on Jul 12, 2011 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Giants, Roll Out!!!
Yes, I am a Giants fan. Now that we got that out of the way....
IMPEACH DOLAN!!!!
I will not - lose! -Jay Z-
With language, we rarely make something up ourselves.
I give that an A+ as far as Nick Names go, and I’ll be using it myself. :-)
Just get it done already...
now if only my 'The Man' would catch on so we could get rid of 'Ham'
Yes, I am a Giants fan. Now that we got that out of the way....
IMPEACH DOLAN!!!!
I will not - lose! -Jay Z-
sounds worth giving strong consideration to.
I’ll try it here: I really like the Manning to The Man tandem this upcoming season. Not bad wildre.
Just get it done already...
thanks tommy
take that Rorschach! :p
Yes, I am a Giants fan. Now that we got that out of the way....
IMPEACH DOLAN!!!!
I will not - lose! -Jay Z-
umm...

Details of the operations of an interstate dog fighting ring were revealed, with some portions involving drugs and gambling. Gruesome details involving abuse, torture and execution of under-performing dogs ... He admitted to being involved in the destruction of 6–8 dogs, by hanging or drowning...
by Simms-McConkey on Jul 13, 2011 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
who? the ham or Simms?
Get Better, Not Bitter.
by BigBlueIntervention on Jul 13, 2011 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Maclin's stats not much better than MMs
I like Maclin but before we but I got to go with Austin over him
Mario last two seasons
57 catches 885 yards 5 TD’s 2009
60 catches 944 yards 9 TD’s 2010
Maclin
56 catches 773 yards 4 TD’s 2009
70 cathces 964 yards 10 TD’s 2010
Maclin is being a little overated on this topic
by Late for Dinner on Jul 13, 2011 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions
My take
Not stat based, just straight up how well they fare as WR in my eyes:
1) Hakeem Nicks
2) Jeremy Maclin
3) DeSean Jackson
4) Miles Austin
5) Dez Bryant
6) Mario Manningham
7) Santana & Redskins co.
The big surprise is probably Maclin at 2… well, he is the most consistent Eagles WR, and he can do a lot more than Jackson. Jackson is dangerous to break one at any point, but if they need a catch, Maclin is the guy they have to go to. I put Austin over Bryant simply because he is a bit more proven, and despite Manningham stepping up a bit last year with all the injuries, he is still not there yet as a complete WR.
This list is more accurate, IMO
However, I think Bryant will be higher on this list by the end of the season (unfortunately). I think you can slide Smith in at 7, and maybe Avant before Moss as well.
"Oh sir, the Giants of New York took on the Packers of Green Bay. And in the end, the Giants triumphed by kicking an oblong ball made of pigskin through a big "H". It was a most ripping victory."
Agreed
I think he will move up too… but I am basing on current take on things.
Yep
I also think one caveat to everyone’s list is: “insert newly-acquired Redskins WR here” when free agency starts.
"Oh sir, the Giants of New York took on the Packers of Green Bay. And in the end, the Giants triumphed by kicking an oblong ball made of pigskin through a big "H". It was a most ripping victory."
You and I have identical lists except for we have Dez and Ham flipped. I guess that's for potential?
Because Ham showed us alot last year as he became the focus of the defense when everyone around him went down
Just get it done already...
Yeah I saw that after I agreed with bri
I’d take either one of those lists. As far as current career goes, MM is better, but Dez has a lot of potential. Is his potential going to work out to be better than MM? We’ll see, I guess.
"Oh sir, the Giants of New York took on the Packers of Green Bay. And in the end, the Giants triumphed by kicking an oblong ball made of pigskin through a big "H". It was a most ripping victory."
I have this saved to copy-paste for NFC East WR discussions because they always pop up
I am going to list out the stats of the top 3 receivers on the Giants, Eagles, and Cowboys in the last year they were healthy.
NY Giants
Steve Smith (2009, 16 gms): 107 catches, 1220 yds, 11.4 YPC, 7 TDs
Smith clearly has a defined role in the Giants offense. Consider that he led the league in catches that resulted in 1st downs. Yes, he has little to no YAC, but that’s not his purpose. He is there to get open, make catches, and convert them for 1st downs. 100+ catches, 1000+ yards, 5+ TDs, leading the league in 1st down conversions. Done. If you want Steve Smith’s 2010 campaign where he played with a torn pectoral and hampered by knee injuries, his line was still decent for only playing half a season: 48 catches, 529 yds, 11.0 YPC, 3 TDs.
Hakeem Nicks (2010, 13 gms): 79 catches, 1052 yds, 13.3 YPC, 11 TDs
Clearly the leader of the WR group, he fits the #1 WR profile with solid all around stats. These impressive numbers are in 13 games, not 16. 3 more games, and he’d have a chance to eclipse 100 receptions as well and possibly add even more TDs.
Mario Manningham (2010, 16 gms): 60 catches, 994 yds, 15.7 YPC, 9 TDs
He has a clearly defined role as well. His strong YPC indicates that he’s the burner that stretches defenses. 9 TDs is incredible for the #3 receiver, and he came within 6 yards of giving the Giants a tandem of 1000 yd receivers
Philadelphia Eagles
Desean Jackson (2010, 14 gms) 47 catches, 1056 yds, 22.5 YPC, 6 TDs Jackson plays the same role as Manningham does in the Giants offense. He’s the burner, and has got an insane 22.5 YPC. Basically an upgraded Mario, and he only played 14 games, imagine what he does in 16. Only thing Mario has him beat in, was TDs.
Jeremy Maclin (2010, 16 gms) 70 catches, 964 yds, 13.8 YPC, 10 TDs
Maclin has similar production to Nicks (I’d argue that Nicks did better because he had slightly better stats in 13 games, whereas Maclin got these stats in 16), but clearly, Maclin has shown the ability to take over a game, and be the #1 WR that the Eagles expect him to be in a couple years. His stats from this past year already push him into the upper echelon of WRs as is. Fits the profile as the #1.
Jason Avant (2010, 16 gms) 51 catches, 573 yds, 11.2 YPC, 1 TD
I personally am not a fan of Avant, but my Eagle buddies have sworn by his talent, so I believe them. In the Philly games that I have seen, he has been a presence and has solid hands. His skill set is similar to Steve Smith’s, and plays the same position in the slot. His YAC is slightly better than Smith’s, 5.2 to 3.4.
Dallas Cowboys
Miles Austin (2010, 16 gms) 69 catches, 1041 yds, 15.1 YPC, 7 TDs
Austin doesn’t fill into a particular WR archetype (#1 WR, burner, slot). He’s a mix between a burner and #1 all-around type. That’s okay though, because he was extremely productive. His YPC was very impressive, not quite Manningham (definitely not Desean) but well above Nicks and Maclin. His catches and TDs were lower than Nicks and Maclin, but his catches exceeded Desean and Mario. He was middle of the pack when it came to TDs.
Dez Bryant (2010, 12 gms) 45 catches, 561 yards, 12.5 YPC, 6 TDs
Based on these numbers, Bryant is right on track to compete with Maclin and Nicks as he profiles as Dallas’ true #1 WR. He is right on track with Nicks or Maclin in their rookie seasons (Nicks: 14gms, 47, 790, 16.8, 6TD and Maclin: 15gms, 56, 773, 13.8, 4TD).
Roy Williams (2010, 15 gms) 37 catches, 530 yards, 14.3 YPC, 5 TDs
Roy Williams projects as another burner, with a higher than average YPC (in 2009, it was 15.7). He has a low number of catches, and a high TD to catch ratio (which is seen in the burner type).
What I’ve seen people do is compare different types of receivers. You can’t do that, because their roles in the offense are all different. If you want to compare each receiver, you do it by their skill sets. Therefore,
Compare: Hakeem Nicks, Dez Bryant, Jeremy Maclin, Miles Austin for the #1 WR all-around type.
Compare: Steve Smith and Jason Avant for the slot WR type
Compare: Desean Jackson, Mario Manningham, Roy Williams, Miles Austin for the burner type.
Based on statistics alone, my rankings would be:
type: Hakeem Nicks, Jeremy Maclin, Miles Austin, Dez Bryant.
I put Nicks first because his stats are similar (even slightly higher in catches, yards, and TDs) to Maclin’s, but he did it in fewer games, therefore the potential is much higher for him. Austin, I had a hard time placing, but even though he had production, as the #1 receiver archetype, he was a bit less successful. Its not fair to compare Dez to these guys, because he’s a rookie, but he’s following in the footsteps. It remains to be seen if he continues, however, but the upside is evident.
Slot: Steve Smith, Jason Avant
I rate Steve Smith higher because, well, he has the production to back it up with hard, solid evidence. You can say Jason Avant is better, and to you I say, great! I need that assertion backed up by statistical proof.
Burner: Desean Jackson, Miles Austin, Mario Manningham, Roy Williams
Desean Jackson is the clear winner, because his YPC is so ridiculously high. He had fewer catches than Manningham but almost as many TDs and had more yards. The reason for Manningham’s high TD total was due to the fact that he had to switch roles late in the year to become a #1 WR, and filled in admirably. Miles Austin comes in 2nd because of the great production he’s had, although I do believe that Manningham is a better "pure" burner than Austin is. Roy Williams is just not very good.
In conclusion, it does not make sense to just line up all the receivers and rank them. You HAVE to do it this way. Miles Austin is the only one that doesn’t fall into a particular archetype which made it hard for me to rank him. Just because he ranked 3rd and 2nd in two archetypes, doesn’t mean that he is bad, its just, those other receivers are better at that pure role. Austin has his hybrid role, and plays it well.
These stats were taken off NFL.com
Get Better, Not Bitter.
by BigBlueIntervention on Jul 11, 2011 10:40 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
This is what I started to do. But got tired.
You did it better than I would have anyway. :-)
Just get it done already...
My List:
1. Hakeem Nicks
2. Miles Austin
3. Jeremy Maclin
4. DeSean Jackson
5. Dez Bryant
6. Mario Manningham
7. Santana Moss
1,2,and 3 on my list are pretty much tied, because they can all do it all.
If Miles Austin wasn't a Cowboy
he wouldn’t get half the publicity he gets now.
Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
-John Madden
Austin is not all that good
all he does is run crossing patterns and since he’s big, strong and fast, he breaks tackles and runs a long way. As far as actually running routs, he blows.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
he's big, strong and fast, and breaks tackles and runs a long way?
sounds to me like you described a good wide receiver.
Yes, I am a Giants fan. Now that we got that out of the way....
IMPEACH DOLAN!!!!
I will not - lose! -Jay Z-
it does doesn't it
but 90% of what makes a good WR is what’s done before the catch, and the only way Austin does anything is if they put training wheels on him with his route running
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
What's with all this love for Maclin
Manningham is just as good, if not better than the guy. I mean look at the stats, Ham was the better player last season clearly. Ham is the third receiver on the depth chart for the Giants, and your comparing him to, arguably the Eagles #1.
Hell even the season before last (yes it was Maclin’s rookie season, but you could say it was Ham’s rook season too, seeing as he didn’t see much of the field his first year) Ham put up better numbers with less touches.
i think we judge 'The Man' Manningham harshly here
because we’ve seen his goofs. running routes out of bounds, losing his starting spot to Nicks, fumbling the ball when hardly touched, inbounds, to the Sheagles(that one still burns), not being the brightest bulb in the pack, etc. in actuality, you’re right, he’s real good, and puts his numbers up in a considerably smaller window, playing as a 3rd wide receiver/spot starter. ‘The Man’ is good, just how good i don’t think we’ll know til he’s the clear cut starter here, or elsewhere.
Yes, I am a Giants fan. Now that we got that out of the way....
IMPEACH DOLAN!!!!
I will not - lose! -Jay Z-
losing his starting spot to Nicks
can hardly blame him for that.
With all of these guys the numbers only tell half of the story. We see Super Mario week in and week out, and know how much better our team would be if he’d cut out the mental errors. But my thought is any of the number 2’s listed here have the same amount of ineptitude…. that’s why they are number 2’s.
Of course that is if there is a season.
Maclin is better IMO
and Terrell Thomas would probably agree.
factor in Maclin is a year younger as well…
FIX IT
You have Maclin way too low
I know, I’m an Eagles fan, I’m biased, I’m an idiot, I stomp on children’s faces while all my friends cheer… I got it. But Maclin is more of a Hakeem Nicks clone than Dez is, IMO. Here’s how I’d rank it.
1) Nicks. Hurts to put him above our guys, but objectively, the numbers support it.
2) Maclin. DeSean is one of the most explosive WRs in football, but Maclin is insanely underrated. He reminds me of Reggie Wayne, and I think he’ll have a similar career.
3) Dez. I hate him, but if he doesn’t eff up from an off-the-field standpoint I think he’ll be amazing.
4) DeSean. Most explosive offensive player in the game (QBs not withstanding). Also means he’s boom or bust, and he’s had a few bust games.
5) Manningham. Upper-middle class man’s DeSean. Very explosive, but lacks DeSean’s acceleration. Still a damn good player.
6) Smith. He’s a great third down/posession guy, but being a checkdown guy blows up his numbers like crazy. (See LeSean McCoy’s receiving numbers for more information on that subject).
7) Austin. Way overrated. The guy became the primary option in an offense that couldn’t run the ball, which blew up his numbers. He’s not bad, but he’s not Pro-Bowl caliber.
8) Santana Moss. Three years ago he’d be ranked higher, but I just don’t see it. Maybe a product of his team, though.
Bleeding Green Nation -- Home of the REAL Slim Shady
36-5-20-JJ Bleeding Green Forever
completely agree
you eagle fans do stomp on children’s faces, etc… Hahaha, but all jokes aisde, this is how I would rate them too.
"Sack-Forced Fumble-TD against any QB in the history of the NFL.... honestly, It would probably be Eli because I see him in pratice and we can't touch him (laughs)" - Justin Tuck
by The Always Well Dressed... on Jul 12, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
No need for that first sentence.
I don’t think you’ll get that kind of hate now that shitepants is gone.
Just get it done already...
Wait wait wait
I thought because we were Giants fans we’re biased, idiots, and stomp on children’s faces while all my friends cheer!
(kidding)
Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
-John Madden
Pretty big talk
considering the guy has yet to play a single snap. Don’t get me wrong, I hope you are right, but seems like a humungous leap of faith to state this.
Yeah, lets save the Nick Names
for when somebody actually does something on the NFL level. Like how Kenny Phillips was named Superman. I hope one day he lives up to that name, but for now, it’s kind of a joke, IMO.
Just get it done already...
it's actually called
being optimistic and a fan. Doesn’t matter if he hasn’t played a snap or not, that doesn’t mean you should go around expecting the worst.
I can't speak for anyone else,
but I certainly don’t go around expecting the worst! I’m very much a “glass half full” kind of a man. So hey, you wanna nickname ‘em, don’t let me rain on your parade, it’s all good bro.
Just get it done already...
???
To be honest, I don’t even get where you two are coming from. lol, & I forgot one more thing in that last comment, it’s also called having a sense of humor.
I think you are lacking said sense of humour
if my cautioning you on making grand claims like him “shutting these receivers down” is twisting you up like so. I personally am a “prove it” sort, and thus far he has proved nothing in the league, though I am hopeful he can be a very good player.
???
What was said wasn’t even about him being a good player or not.
His name is Prince and he plays for the New York Giants, which is also a pun off of the television comedy "The Prince of Bel-Air . We are talking about the best Wide Receivers in the NFC East. Do I have to mention that the Redskins, Cowboys and Eagles are our rivals? The Giants drafted him in the 1st round with hopes of him becoming a good cornerback, and as an enthusiastic fan, wouldn’t one go that far?
I was just confused initially how someone could take something like that so seriously. “pretty big talk,” “nicknames,” lol… what’s up with you two?
H. Nicks
S. Smith
M. Manningham
D. Hagan
D. Calhoun
M. Clayton
D. Thomas
V. Cruz
D. Reynaud
R. Bomar
this is what it sounds like when the birds cry
Hixon?
"Sack-Forced Fumble-TD against any QB in the history of the NFL.... honestly, It would probably be Eli because I see him in pratice and we can't touch him (laughs)" - Justin Tuck
by The Always Well Dressed... on Jul 14, 2011 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions

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