New York Giants' Notes: Draft Grades? Because We Know You Love 'Em
by Ed Valentine on May 7, 2011 7:00 AM EDT
in New York Giants News
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PrintEven though I did my own grades following the New York Giants' 2011 NFL Draft, I have to agree with Ralph Vacchiano of the New York Daily News when he writes that he has "never really understood" the rush to judgment.
What it comes down to is that fans love football. They love to study it, they love to talk about, they love to argue about and dissect every move their team makes -- or doesn't make. So, silly or not, mostly meaningless or not, sometimes we give you things for one simple reason. We know you want them.
After his little commentary on draft grades, my friend Ralph did offer a nice breakdown of the Giants' draft. We have done a lot of that here, of course, but please check out Ralph's take. We all know you can never get enough.
Kevin Boss, who could leave the Giants as a free agent, is working out with the Giants' receivers and quarterbacks at Hoboken (N.J.) High School. Boss says he is not yet 100 percent after off-season hip surgery.
"I'm still not cleared to go 100% yet, but I’m out there doing what I can," Boss said. "I'm just a couple weeks away from being able to go full speed." Boss was able to work out with his teammates on Tuesday and should be a full-go for training camp."
Over at Giants101 they are speculating about the possibility of bringing linebacker Kawika MItchell back to the Giants whenever teams are allowed to begin signing free agents. Mitchell played well for the Giants in his only season in New York, which happened to be the year the Giants won the Super Bowl, and there might be an opening with the Giants seemingly unlikely to bring back veteran Keith Bulluck.
But, Mitchell? Why? At 31, he missed all but one game last season with a knee injury and, in fact, has played just six games in the past two seasons. If you are going to bring in a guy like Mitchell, you might as well just keep Bulluck who is at least one year farther removed from his own major knee injury. Or, just let Clint Sintim play and find out what you have. Maybe you bring in a guy like this as insurance, but you certainly don't bring him in and expect him to be an impact player -- something he hasn't been in three seasons.
Interesting note in a post-draft analysis by Andrew Perloff of SI.com:
The Eagles need to find a consistent starter at cornerback across from Asante Samuel. Some Philly fans believe the Giants took Prince Amukamara at No. 19 just so Philly couldn't fit that hole with the 23rd pick. The Eagles also need to bolster their defensive line, and ignored all the highly touted defensive ends to take guard Danny Watkins in the first round. The Eagles had the worst red-zone defense in the league last year and need to improve their personnel to help new defensive coordinator Juan Castillo succeed.
I really don't believe the Giants would do that -- that is sort of a silly Yankees-Red Sox thing. Still, an interesting critique of what the Eagles did -- and did not do -- in the draft.
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There's no way in HELL
We used a first round pick just so Philly couldn’t have one guy. It was surely an added bonus, but no way Reese is thinking “Okay I want this guy, but let’s take Prince just so the Eagles can’t get him”
they still could hae gotten jimmy smith
But chose watkins
by omfGIANTS on May 7, 2011 7:59 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
If there ever was a time for a defensive collapse for the Eagles, this is the year
no stability at CB (unless they get Nnamdi). A rookie and 1-year starter at the safety spots…lot of inexperience in the backend. A whole bunch of mediocre LBzez. Defensive line has no great depth and Brandon Graham may not even be ready to go for the start of the year.
Oh, and did I mention that their new defensive coordinator has never coached defense (unless you count highschool).
They have a nasty offense, but in the 2nd year of our scheme and the influx of talent we’ve brought in, I think we’re more equipped to handle it. Now its just a matter of our offense crushing that pathetic excuse for a defense.
Bow to the Fresh Prince of the Meadowlands.
by BigBlueIntervention on May 7, 2011 9:31 AM EDT reply actions
don't count 'em out
but they certainly are not the infallible team many people say they are…especially on defense.
Bow to the Fresh Prince of the Meadowlands.
by BigBlueIntervention on May 7, 2011 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree that its time for them to struggle however
I have a feeling that it will be the Cowboys and Giants from the NFC East that make the playoffs this year.
by mclaren_is_the_best on May 7, 2011 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions
would be nice to keep the defense out there a lot
and quit this fumble and INT crap.
Cut those down by a third and we win 11 or 12 games last year.
It's one of the best way to beat the Eagles
is put Vick in constant pass mode. Yes, it didn’t work last year but it worked for all the other teams when they made Vick one dimensional.
Please get Phil Simms in the Hall of Fame
Fewell developed the blueprint to beat Vick
unfortunately they couldn’t finish off the game
by mclaren_is_the_best on May 7, 2011 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions
That game was proof of the adage
Stick to the plan
On the plays where the D broke contain or tried to ake a big play on the back end they got burned. If they forced Eagles to simply run 5 more plays, they might never get the ball back for tying TD
absolutely
Bow to the Fresh Prince of the Meadowlands.
by BigBlueIntervention on May 7, 2011 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Vick will regress from last year
that’s why I think they’ll collapse
Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
-John Madden
Yea, we drafted a top 10 player so Philly couldn’t get him. I guess cuz the only thing Philly has accomplished over the past few years (well…really ever) is beating the Giants, that’s all they can think about. Pretty sure we drafted Prince cuz he’s really, really friggin good.
Bringing back Kawika Mitchell is just a bad idea. He was good for Buffalo in 2008, but the past 2 seasons he’s been in the witness protection program.
Vacchiano has some interesting points:
Last year we didn’t have a “nickel corner”, that’s why Grant was on the field so much. I guess Aaron Ross is that bad, huh.
Our DT depth is a bit overblown, since Bernard is old and a ?, Cofield might be gone, and Joseph has barely played. Given how important those trenches are, Austin might not have been as much a “luxury” as its made out to be. And he also said a lot of scouts called Austin dominant in college.
I disagree 100% with his Jernigan vs. Barden/Moss assessment. It just sounds like Ralph is trying to level with the many people who never saw Barden or Jernigan play and are just going off what they hear about his college numbers and how fast he is. The Moss comparison is pretty embarrassing for anyone who makes it too. Jernigan is NOT a Ramses Barden type project. He’s NOT a whimp like Sinorice Moss.
Troy was on more then a few times last year and that’s all he does is make big plays. He didn’t even have to “step up” and make them. Barden was just tall and ran fade routes.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
what?
OK, I get Santana Moss over Sinorice.
But Tiki was much better then his brother. And Eli was on this team when we won a Super Bowl, in case you were in a coma.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
I think his JJ breakdown was get a grip
The guy has never played a down in the NFL and people have him penciled in as PR 3rd down specialist and maybe SS12 replacement in the slot
That may be his pot’l, but if he just does well at PR and can see some time as the 4th WR it will be a god season for him
I dunno who's penciling him in for that
if that’s who he’s referring to in order to get a grip, it sounds like he’s talking to the wall.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
I just think it is funny
That we end up with the lesser brother. Don’t get me wrong I love Eli. Loved Tiki until he went Scott Stapp on us (aka Crazy) and then turned out to be a scumbag husband. But I think you could argue that all 3 are the lesser brother. I was glad we didn’t get Pouncy or Matthews just for that reason.
I think taking Prince
and the Eagles missing out was just an added bonus. I’m sure even the Eagles had almost no idea he would fall that far.
Please get Phil Simms in the Hall of Fame
Nice job by RV
I liked the reference to the late Tom Boisture’s " trust the film" motto. He was a big part of the Giants front office as personnel director during our glory days along side George Young. JR said sometimes you need to “respect production” in reference to the Jones pick. Same thing, I guess.
I do wonder if RV was aware that Williams had put on 18 lbs. and is up to 233 since the end of last season.
Go Giants!
Eagles will pursue Nnamdi hard.
While it’s possible they might have taken Prince, I think they recognize the need for an established quality corner.
by Tucker Fredrickson on May 7, 2011 11:49 AM EDT reply actions
according to Eagles fans
they’ll trade Klob for Pat Peterson and a 2012 first rounder
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
That's quite possible too
As much as I hate those green devils, they usually have a pretty good plan to put a competitive team on the field
by Tucker Fredrickson on May 7, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
its really not possible
the 2012 1st round pick thing might be, but anyone who says its for Pat Peterson is most likely a Philly fan or writer.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
It's also possible that no one wants to trade for a QB because they'll have no time to coach em up
Also Cassell = 2 twos, hard time seeing Klob fetch more
More likely they get Davon House and a 2nd
I thought Cassel
was just for one “2”, and that was with Vrabel
Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
-John Madden
Matt Schaub was 2 twos
Cassel was a two, Vrabel and a big fat contract. That’s more likely what Klob will be worth. Especially since he didn’t come close to doing as well as Cassel in his starting time.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
And Klob (like that one)
doesn’t have nearly the sample size of starts as Cassel had before his trade to KC. i think only a desperate (stupid) team would give up a first round draft choice for Klob. Who’s also shown he may have durability (toughness) issues going forward besides.
Just get it done already...
What!?
Are the Cards that desperate/dumb? I mean, I kinda like Kolb. But Peterson plus next year’s 1st round pick? That’s crazy to me.
Go Giants!
I don't think Kolb is worth it
He is OK but not great thus far.
Would take a lot more than a Philly first rounder which may be far down.
I think the Nnamdi situation is more probable and I hope we will too, but do not believe we will go for it.
If he is on their team, it is a massive boost for them and trouble for us.
All the Giants should play like Mark Bavaro.
Tom Quinn Must Go!
On second thought, let's not blame players or coaches, they are not responsible. The unsupportive fans are to blame.
by UnknownJintsFan on May 7, 2011 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Unfortunately, Reid is in the catbird seat with Kolb
There are teams out there who need a QB who didn’t get one in the draft. If I’m Andy Reid, I’m holding those teams up for Kolb. His contract is reasonable for a backup, and Reid could hang on to him for the 2011 season as insurance for Vick, and then trade him prior to the 2012 draft. If I’m Reid, I only trade him if my trade partner is willing to pay a high premium for the privilege of “no payments for one season.”
The rumor is that everyone in the NFC East is going to be in on the Asomugha sweepstakes. Too many #1 receivers in the division. The Giants need to be in on that as well. The Giants also have an advantage as they could unload Webster’s contract to create the cap room. If the Giants do not get Asomugha, they must make sure that if a division rival gets him, they pay through the nose.
Kolb's a FA next offseason
Though I guess that depends on what the new CBA stipulates is a FA. The Eagles have to trade him this offseason.
The NFL and NFLPA? They can kiss my ass, OK? They can line up and kiss my ass.
Kolb's a free agent
I think no matter what.
He got an extension last year, so I don’t think he can become an RFA again
Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
-John Madden
I was wrong
Kolb only signed a 1 year extension for $12.25 million keeping him under control through 2011. Reid has to trade him. I thought the extension was for more years that kept him there for the forseeable future.
some philly fans can be so damn irrational sometimes its almost offensive
or wait nvm, maybe teams are just that dumb. kolb just isnt worth multiple players and a first rounder
average arm strength, average upside, struggles to read coverages, looks clueless against pressure-man defenses, i could go on with that mans flaws as a book. id rather draft a rookie QB than him. he was a 3rd/4th round talent in college who the eagles reached for in the 2nd round and now hes worth patrick peterson and a first? Give a damn break, those delusional fans
It will certainly upgrade their CB corps
They will essentially have a shutdown corner in Asomugha, a rich man’s deangelo hall in Asante, and their nickel will be Joselio Hanson.
It’s okay, you can put Nnamdi and Asante on Hakeem and SS12….we’ll kill you with Manningham when yer forced to put hanson on him. Obvious mismatch. Nate Allen and Jaiquawn Jarrett are good, but still inexperienced.
I’ll take Prince-Cweb-TT-Antrel-KP over Nnamdi-Asante-Joselio-Allen-Jarrett all day, everyday. We don’t have any shutdown corners, but we’ve got 3 very very good ones and amazing depth.
Bow to the Fresh Prince of the Meadowlands.
by BigBlueIntervention on May 7, 2011 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions
whan we were trying to find plex's replacement was it not the eagles that traded that pick to
the G-MEN and they end up getting wr,r.barden so they help us try to get plex’s replacment but now we steal a player from them,confused LOLOL!! oh & Nnamdi will also be pursued hard by cowboys,skins,pat’s,titans ect.wich all have lots of $$$$$$$$.look i’m from philly and proud of it but dont like eagles,phillies & flyers i bit(go-mets,rangers).we (the G-MEN) had half r team out last year i"m talking important starters and wr"s off the street an we still tied them at 10-6 and still it took a miracle 4 us not to make it and 4 them to get in,the iggles SUCK PERIOD and they r
vvvvvvvveeeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrryyyyyyyyyyyyy overrated vic is all they got and only because his running!
by big blue born in philly on May 7, 2011 12:04 PM EDT reply actions
wow, just wow lol
im not gonna insult you, im just saying that there is a strong possibility that you have an extra chromosome
"You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is: never try." Homer Simpson
by JjoneslikesbigD on May 7, 2011 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions
not cool, bro
Bow to the Fresh Prince of the Meadowlands.
by BigBlueIntervention on May 7, 2011 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Silly Yankee Red Sox thing?
Only the Sox do that to spite the Yankees even if the move sucks.
World Series attitude, champagne bottle life, nothing every changes so tonight is like tomorrow night.
As long as we're still grading drafts...
Rabblerousr over on BTB contends that cumulative draft scores are fairly accurate (link) He looks at the 2007 draft to come to this conclusion and says the following about our 2007 G-men:
The Giants were dinged by draft graders for failing to address needs, principally on the offensive line.
Hey, wait, what? Sound familiar much? Indicative of nothing of course, but another 2007 season sounds ok to me ;)
by Amsterdam Admirals on May 7, 2011 12:46 PM EDT reply actions
I'll never understand how we didn't address needs
every single pick was a need. Really the only one that wasn’t a need was Jacquain Williams in the 6th, cuz we drafted 2 LBzers last year and already had one drafted this year.
I wonder if we would’ve “addressed needs” if we drafted Greg Jones in the 2nd and James Brewer in the 3rd?
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
I thought CB was our biggest need then
considering we had Madison and McQuarters starting, Webster was still a disappointment then, and Dockery was getting valuable playing time.
The NFL and NFLPA? They can kiss my ass, OK? They can line up and kiss my ass.
Wah wah wah
“You guys pick all the good players and make us pick old canadian firefighters”
Tell Jackson not to pick up his muffed punt and Prince may have been on the board for you. Take that trade? Didnt think so.
Tell him not to muff it in the first place
and the players may have stood in their lanes…
Self-praise is for losers. Be a winner. Stand for something. Always have class, and be humble.
-John Madden
America's Team MY ASS!
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sigh...
I'll bet Osama bin Laden really regrets buying that iPhone now...
Some people believed last year
the eagles traded up so we couldnt take graham. speculation like that happens lol
That was nonsense propagated by Sal Pal
Graham doesn’t fit the Giants’ mold for pass rushers at all. There was no chance the Giants were taking him.
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