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Giants By The Numbers: 53 Is For ...

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via davepear.com

Harry Carson.

No, this one is not difficult to get right. In the eyes of New York Giants' fans old enough to have seen him play, 53 will always be Carson's number. No matter who wears it -- and that is not meant to offend Bryan Kehl, current occupant of the jersey.

Star-divide

Here is Carson's Giants.com bio.

Harry Carson played his entire 13-year NFL career with the New York Giants. An inside linebacker, he was selected to play in nine Pro Bowls, including seven in a row from 1982-88. Carson led the Giants in tackles six times, was a two-time All-NFL selection and was a leader throughout his career and the captain of the 1986 Super Bowl champions.

Carson joined the Giants as a fourth-round draft choice in 1976 from South Carolina State, where he never missed a game in four seasons, was a two-year captain and a Little All-America selection by the Associated Press. A defensive end in college, Carson successfully made the transition to linebacker with the Giants so quickly and so successfully that he was voted to NFL All-Rookie team.

Carson was a two-time first-team all-pro and a five-time second-team selection. He played 173 games in a Giants uniform – tying him with Keith Hamilton for seventh all-time – and he was a punishing run defender who also intercepted 11 passes. Carson had 17 sacks, 14 fumble recoveries and seven forced fumbles. He had 25 tackles (20 solo) in a Monday night game against Green Bay in 1982 and seven tackles in the Giants’ 39-20 victory over Denver in Super Bowl XXI.

During his prime, Carson was the best run-stopping linebacker in the NFL. In the seven seasons from 1981 to 1987, Giants’ opponents averaged only 3.59 yards per rushing attempt, a remarkable achievement for so long a period. During that period, Carson was credited with 856 tackles, including 627 unassisted tackles.

Carson was a quiet, dignified, dependable presence on some of the best defensive teams the franchise has ever had. He is also the inventor of the Gatorade shower.

Here is more on Carson from his Hall of Fame page.

Carson led by example both on and off the field. Carson, as an inside linebacker, was a ferocious run stopper. Known for his "all-out" style of play, he attacked onrushing blockers head on in his pursuit of the ball carrier. Later in his career when he was joined by outside linebackers Lawrence Taylor and Carl Banks, there was no better linebacker trio in the NFL. Like Taylor, he was extremely difficult to defense in blitzing situations and he had the speed and agility to be an effective pursuit player, even when the play was directed away from his area of responsibility.

Although he was a very consistent player, Carson seemed to produce top performances in key games. That was the case in New York's Super Bowl season. His interception and 12 solo tackles against the Washington Redskins on December 7 virtually assured the Giants of the NFC East title. It was also Carson who made the "big play" on the Giants' first-half goal line stand against the Broncos in the Super Bowl, when he stuffed Gerald Willhite for no gain.

Without doubt, one of my favorite Giants ever, and an all-time great. I would love to hear some of the old-timers weigh in with thoughts on this question. Who was a more dominant middle linebacker, Carson or Sam Huff?

Other Notables Who Have Worn 53
  • John Rapacz was a Giants' center from 1950-54.
  • Greg Larson was a Giants' lineman for 13 seasons, from 1961-73. He was named All-Pro as a center in 1968.
  • Outside linebacker Brandon Short wore 53 with the Giants from 2000-2003. 
  • Linebacker Reggie Torbor had the number from 2004-2007.

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He had 25 tackles (20 solo) in a Monday night game against Green Bay in 1982

WHAT?!?!?!

I didn’t know that…..that’s just crazy.

"Throw the damn ball to Kevin Boss" - Andiamo708

by andiamo708 on Jun 19, 2010 1:22 PM EDT reply actions  

I'd also be interested....

in hearing from people who saw Huff….who was better? Huff or Carson? or was it a push?

"Throw the damn ball to Kevin Boss" - Andiamo708

by andiamo708 on Jun 19, 2010 1:24 PM EDT reply actions  

It's easy when you have to choose between an HOFer

and a non HOFer, but between two HOFers? Plus one who played his whole career ar MLB , the other mostly as OLB? Tough, but I’ll take Huff:

1. Obviously, he has much more historical importance.
  a. He was the key to Landry’s successfull installation of the 4-3.
  b. In terms of popularizing the sport, his role in a TV documentary that showed him palying a game while miked up, was IMO almost as important as, “The Greatest Game ever Played.” At the same time, all the publicity he received as a result, including his picture on the cover of TIME. alienated some fans who thought he was getting too much credit for the team’s great D. His team mates never complained.
  c. Robustelli was the on field leader of that D, but Huff spoke to authority in a way no one else would. Of course he got traded for getting in Allie’s face, but Huff was right.

 d.His head-to-head battles with HOF backs like Brown and Taylor are the stuff of legends.

2. Harry was All-Pro twice. I’m pretty sure Huff received that honor more often.

3. Huff was a first ballot entry to HOF. Harry just slipped in.

4. Huff’’s on the list of 100 Greatest Players of All Time (as is LT0. Carson isn’t.

by blue gonz on Jun 19, 2010 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1

A difficult comparison between two great players from different eras, made more difficult by the fact that Huff was a 4-3 MLB and Carson was a 3-4 ILB.
I also go with Huff, for the reasons stated plus:
> Carson had better linebacker help, playing between LT and Carl Banks. Huff had Cliff Livingston and Tom Scott (I admit I had to look them up), so the opponent could concentrate more on Huff – although he did play next to Harland Svare in the late 50s.
> Huff was first team all-pro 4 times and is on the 1950s All-Decade team.
> Huff was traded to Washington in 1964 (another Allie Sherman mistake) and is on the list of 70 Greatest Redskins
As for #53 – unquestionably Carson. No one else is close.

Mickey C

by Mickey C on Jun 19, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes Harry's the man here for sure..

He was a monster on the field and pure gentleman off of it..
Andia…Sam Huff was also one of our greats..Not only his play, but his battles with Jim Brown..they were classic..He is also famous for running off the field and telling the offense: “Hold’em !!”lol

"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"

by Bobbiblue on Jun 19, 2010 1:52 PM EDT reply actions  

I think because he retired as a Redskin..

"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"

by Bobbiblue on Jun 19, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

You mean Huff

retired as a Redskin, right Bobbi?

by Ed Valentine on Jun 19, 2010 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes I was talking about Sam Huff..

"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"

by Bobbiblue on Jun 19, 2010 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Retired numbers

I think it’s just a case of you can’t retire every number because you need soo many uniform numbers available. As it is, go to training camp and there are invariably a handful of guys wearing ‘duplicate’ numbers already.

by Ed Valentine on Jun 19, 2010 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I understand what you're saying Ed,

…but “53” is a number that should not be worn again by any other Giant. Carson was/is the walking definition of a New York Giant. Might be time to do like college and let LBs were odd numbers like 5 or something in the teens…..just my opinion.

by njgiant on Jun 19, 2010 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

I hear you

The whole ‘numbers thing’ where certain positions are in certain number ranges is kind of silly.

by Ed Valentine on Jun 19, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Harry Rules

Got to point out that in the 4-3 it’s the D-line that makes the MLB, and Huff had a good one.
Harry got to ProBowl in the 4-3 with Meandenhall, Archer and Jeter, That was a good line but the 60’s guys were better.

3-4 inside is a totally different animal, blockers will come from anywhere, Harry would knock the blocker on his ass and then make the play. On people like John Riggins, Check out his shoulder pads, they’re like Viking shields, there was a reason for that.

But I don’t think comparing guys from different eras is really valid, when Jim Brown played he was as heavy as a lot of d-line guys. The nose tackle for the dolphins in ’72 was under 260. Reggie White or Ray Lewis would have stopped him dead or taken him down from behind.

Conan!, What is good in Football?!

Daa.... to run between the tackles,
To drive the linebackers before you,
And to hear the lamentations of the cheerleaders.

by The Pale Scot on Jun 20, 2010 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

Comparing guys from diferent eras

is at the very least difficult and perhaps, as you say, invalid. Unfortunately, when you’re going through an exercize such as this numbers game we’ve been playing or choosing an All-Time Team, which we did last year, such comparisons are inevitable.
One thing about the position Carson played: it seems to be undervalued. I think Harry’s the first (maybe the second) guy who played it to make the HOF.

by blue gonz on Jun 21, 2010 9:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

Retired Numbers

1 — Ray Flaherty
4 — Tuffy Leemans
7 — Mel Hein
11 — Phil Simms
14 — Y.A. Tittle
16 — Frank Gifford
32 — Al Blozis
40 — Joe Morrison
42 — Charlie Conerly
50 — Ken Strong
56 — Lawrence Taylor

by Ed Valentine on Jun 19, 2010 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

At this point no

but Carson’s number should be retired. Watched him for his entire career and he should have been a first or at least second ballet hall of fame but people,reporters don’t really know what they are talking about, so he wasn’t

by Coda on Jun 19, 2010 9:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

This came up before,

and I suggested the same.
Two great minds…
It would allow all the unifrom #s of HOF Giants to be retired.

by blue gonz on Jun 19, 2010 3:25 PM EDT reply actions  

LOL!!!

"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"

by Bobbiblue on Jun 19, 2010 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

My favourite Carson Play

was in the 84 playoff game against the 49ers .

I can still visualise the play as described by Maddon as Carson picked off Montana and scored on an 14 yard Int return when he read a slant pass.

The commentary was something like

“Picked off Carson he’s to the ten, five Touchdown”

Anyone else remember that play.

by G Fan in England on Jun 19, 2010 3:44 PM EDT reply actions  

Carson also played a pivotal role in the '86 Vikings game, they were losing at the end of the half..

Parcells said that he didn’t have to say anything at half-time..Harry was busting up chairs and throwing them, screaming and hollering..They went out like wildmen in the 2nd half..Of course the key play was 4th and 17..Simms threw a dart to Johnson..they went on to win and went undefeated the remainder of the year..Harry did’nt just invent the Gatorade bath..he created “The Big Blue Wrecking Crew” with his leadership.

"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"

by Bobbiblue on Jun 19, 2010 4:00 PM EDT reply actions  

Coin toss Super Bowl XX!

There are 5 or 6 Bronco co-captains and Harry! The biggest game in Giant history and only one man needs to be there to represent the ball club. That tells you all you need to know about the man, statistics need not apply.

by Giovanni Alessi on Jun 19, 2010 5:22 PM EDT reply actions  

Hell Yea!

I’d forgotten that.

Conan!, What is good in Football?!

Daa.... to run between the tackles,
To drive the linebackers before you,
And to hear the lamentations of the cheerleaders.

by The Pale Scot on Jun 20, 2010 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

Thats Super Bowl XXI

If anyone has a picture of that coin toss, I’d appreciate a look.

by Giovanni Alessi on Jun 19, 2010 5:23 PM EDT reply actions  

Harry Carson Superbowl 21 coin toss picture

This is the only picture i could find and it is not a closeup or detail but you can see that ONE Giants was enough among ALL those Bronco jerseys lol.

http://sportsroids.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/sportsroids-harry-carson-coin-toss1.jpg

by BB1156 on Jun 19, 2010 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

The thing I remember most about Carson

is that he reaked havoc on the opposing team, and especially if they were inside the 10. He really made it tough for teams to score, and he had a nose like a prized bloodhound – could sniff out a play from a mile away.

We didn't even have a chance for the "perfect season", but we did have the perfect ending.

by GAgiantfan on Jun 19, 2010 6:23 PM EDT reply actions  

A true gladiator of his time.

I am just glad he was on our side.

Fan's Creed: (Play well+Win=Praise) (Play Well+Lose=Praise) (Play Lousy+Win=Criticism) (Play lousy+Lose & Bandwagon Jumpers=Off with thier heads!)

by LoNJDTechnology on Jun 19, 2010 7:32 PM EDT reply actions  

Retired Jerseys

I’m surprised the Giants (and Jets) didn’t create some kind of “Ring of Honor” in the new stadium for retired players. They can honor players without running out of jersey numbers.

by John W on Jun 19, 2010 9:56 PM EDT reply actions  

That's a good idea

I haven’t been to the stadium but I hope there’s a museum area where you can learn about old Giants.

by GhostDini on Jun 20, 2010 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

Carson

Was one of the very few players to start in the wasteland years and be part of the turnaround into the glory years

Even in the midst of the wasteland, Carson fought hard on every play

by NYERinSF on Jun 19, 2010 10:03 PM EDT reply actions  

Harry Carson is my favorite Giant

I grew up watching the Giants from 1968 on. Never really got to see Sam Huff except in clips. Huff was great, no doubt about it. Hell, Jim Brown complimented the guy as being one of the most difficult defenders he ever faced. That says a whole lot right there.

If I had seen Huff play, possibly my opinion would be different but for me Harry Carson WAS the Giants. He exemplified everything about their defense. Rock solid, relentless, smart as a whip with a “Don’t even think about coming into my gap on third and 2” mentality. But above all, he had a quiet leadership presence. I remember watching the cameras pan on the defense on the sidelines and everyone would be looking at Harry. Shoot, I loved how LT, Gary Reasons and Carl Banks played, but Carson was the glue. Harry would have that dog tired, worn out look like someone who had just run a marathon, stand up, put his helmet on and — I really can’t explain it — but everyone seemed to respond like they knew they had to go the extra mile with him. There was just that SOMETHING. LT was incredible and crazy sometimes, but remember, LT never bucked Harry Carson. Even he didn’t want to go there. For me, Harry Carson made the Giants my team.

by BigScore on Jun 19, 2010 10:18 PM EDT reply actions  

Larsen, larsen

Greg Larsen was a great center caught in the middle of a mediocre line (the great Roosevelt Brown at offensive tackle the exception) with Allie Sherman and Alex Webster as the head coach. Do I need say more?

by bongoman19 on Jun 20, 2010 12:18 PM EDT reply actions  

I understand

you can’t retire every number but it should only be worn by a player worthy of wearing it.

LT was the super star on defense and in the league but there was no question Harry was the leader on defense.

by FrankB03 on Jun 22, 2010 3:41 PM EDT reply actions  

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