What is Your Depth Chart?
by GhostDini on May 31, 2010 8:30 PM EDT
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If anything could be considered a bright spot from the 2009 season, then it would have to be the emergence of the Giants' wide receivers.
Steve Smith established himself as a legitimate threat in the intermediate game, setting a single-season franchise record for receptions. He has an uncanny knack for finding soft spots in the defense.
Hakeem Nicks showed a big play-making ability. He was tied for first in receiving yards by a rookie WR and was top 20 out of all WRs in AVG yards per reception. That's not bad for a player who had only six starts, especially since Giants rookie WRs often don't fare well.
As for Mario Manningham, his rookie year was stunted by missing training camp with an injury then missing various games with a sickness. Despite his issues with the sidelines and dropped passes, Manningham still managed to be 2nd in total yards, yards per game, and TDs out of all 2nd-year WRs. Out of all no. 2 WRs in the NFL, he was top-seven in yards and receptions.
One player who didn't get much of an opportunity in 2009 but figures to be a player in 2010 is Ramses Barden. Besides the fact that Jerry Reese moved up to take him in the draft and Barden had a stellar performance in training camp, there isn't a lot that can be said about him. He played in only three games and didn't get his lone reception of the year until Week 17. It's good that Smith is mentoring him. We're all hopeful that he can be integrated into the red zone offense, at the very least.
Let's say that all four wide receivers will develop their game and progress in 2010. Let's say that the Giants' passing attack will be considered one of the best in the league. Fans of teams like Cleveland and Chicago, who have no wide receivers, will look at us with great envy. Barden will have the big 2nd-year jump that Manningham had last year. Manningham will run crisp routes and have fewer drops. Nicks will become a consistent performer week in, week out. Smith will continue to be Eli Manning's most reliable WR.
OK. Here is the question: what is your depth chart?
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Pretty much the same with one wrinkle...
1) Steve Smith, 2) Hakeem Nicks, 3) Super Mario and 4) Dominick Hixon/Ramses Barden in a tight battle. Initially I see Hixon winning this battle but by mid to late season Ramses will be our #4 receiver.
by Robin's-meats-and-vegetables on May 31, 2010 9:50 PM EDT reply actions
His stats notwithstanding
I see Smith as a glorified slot WR. He’s great at getting first downs but he has a terrible YAC average. He doesn’t draw double teams unless it’s third down. He can’t outrun you. He can’t out-jump you. He can’t out-muscle you.
1. Nicks
2. Manningham
3. Smith
4. Barden
Y'know why his YAC is horrible?
Because he’s making all those key first down catches that requires him to be in one spot in a split second where he’s about to get killed if he makes a wrong step.
Smith’s shown to be minimum good anywhere he goes: short, medium, and deep balls, and excellent in others.
Against all odds, against all circumstance were you don't have a shot, you succeed
-Michael Strahan
All you hear about is the past, the past... the past is the !@#$ing past, this is the present.
THIS IS TEMPORARY! A CHAMPIONSHIP IS PERMANENT
-Same as above
I disagree
Just because you’re getting a first down doesn’t mean you can’t have good YAC numbers.
He was 2nd in receptions and 8th in yards but 79th in YAC. There’s no excuse for that.
regardless of YAC
Smith is Eli’s safety valve. The guy is always where he is supposed to be on almost every route. Last year it seemed that he was our substitute for a running game, he was clock management. Get the first and live to fight another series.
He is nowhere near as explosive as Manningham or Nicks, but he is our number one.
That said i’m really hoping for a healthy Nicks to step up and become a true threat on every down. Barden and Manningham can battle for the second wide and we can slice people up with Smith in the slot. It fits the Meadowlands wind in the winter to put our best route runner closer to the QB.
Smith should still lead the team statistically, he’d just be doing it from the slot
more like a security blanket
At times, Smith is to Eli what Meggett was to Brown. Eli forces the ball to him even when he is covered, or forces him to make difficult catches. This reduces his YAC opportunities. This tendency on 3rd down needs to be monitored this year. I remember that Meggett became useless at the end of his Giants career because every defender knew the ball was being thrown to him.
If Manningham makes no drops this preseason, I’ll give him the edge. Making it: Smith, Manningham, Hicks, Hixon. Moss and Hagan play for the 5th spot, loser gets cut. Barden is last but is guaranteed a spot. Next year he’ll move up to the 4th slot.
sure there is
he’s making the catch in a “pocket” of double and triple teams. The only thing he can do on those button hooks is pull a Tory Holt and flop.
He doesn’t run Wes Welker routes. Welker catches 4 yard passes and runs 5. Smith catches 8 yard passes and can only get 2.
He runs button hooks and in routes. Even his deep routes, Eli doesn’t throw the ball out in front enough, he’s got to basically catch it and that’s it.
Could Smith get more YAC? Absolutely, he’s fast enough (pretty sure all his straight line and lateral move speed numbers from his combine makes him the fastest WR on the team…give or take Sinorice Moss).
Write a letter to Kevin Gilbride and Eli Manning and tell them to let Steve get out in the open field more instead of running comeback routes.
Or let Steve jab teams to death so he can continue being the clone of Keenan McCardell that he is. He had a 3.1yd career YAC average. 11, 833 career yards. I’ll take that.
"What's your plan?? Rob Fort Knox on elephant back? That's the dumbest thing I ever heard....."
by FreeBradshaw on May 31, 2010 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree, utilization is the key with Smith
Depending on down and distance, he’ll be utilized on a more traditional sense of the X or Z receiver, but with routes suitable to his strengths. Now, with saying that, it could also be 3rd and five, but like you said, the button hooks and in patterens will only give you a couple/few more yards that are required to keep the drive going. Hence, is low YAC through safer plays which keep drives going. Third and Smith!
Which
means Smith is a smaller version of a T.J. whatchmecallit, a possesion receiver, with better hands than a lot of the so-called elite receivers. I thing Giants fans can live with that, I know I can…I would hope ths year, Nicks & Mario would be more of the deep threats.
His mother has a tattoo that reads, "Son".
"I don't always drink beer, but when I do, I prefer Dos Equis.
Stay thirsty my friends."
by Great Gatsby on Jun 1, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I just find it hard to believe you are criticizing Steve Smith because of his lack of YAC
Around 75% – 80% of his catches are with his back to the endzone.
And personally I’d rather he goes down a few yards sooner if it means he doesn’t fumble or get hurt.
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jun 1, 2010 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
Against all odds, against all circumstance were you don't have a shot, you succeed
-Michael Strahan
All you hear about is the past, the past... the past is the !@#$ing past, this is the present.
THIS IS TEMPORARY! A CHAMPIONSHIP IS PERMANENT
-Same as above
Then he's not a no. 1 or no. 2 WR on this team
If you play your back to the end zone that much, then you’re a slot WR. That might work on teams with no WRs but there is too much talent at WR.
Obviously, nobody wants him to get hurt or fumble. Not fumbling or getting hurt and bad YAC aren’t mutually exclusive though.
He does go to the slot when we have 3 WR's on the field.
But on 2 WR sets I definitely would rather see him on the field than any other WR that is currently on the roster.
It depends on what your definition of a #1 or #2 WR as well.
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jun 2, 2010 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Also a few weeks before the end of the season Steve Smith had the same yards / receptions average as Reggie Wayne
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jun 2, 2010 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I think that the season will start with:
1. Smith
2. Nicks
3. MM
4. Barden
5. Hixon
6. Hagen
I think Nicks, MM, and Barden all have the potential to be the #1 guy….but you gotta do it when it counts, and so far Smith has. so TO START the season that’s my depth chart.
"Throw the damn ball to Kevin Boss" - Andiamo708
That's it
Smith will start because he moves the chains
Nicks will start and compliment Smith……. be a deep threat
Ham will play a lot and will break some dinks for TDs ( there is your YAC)
Barden will be a red zone threat and at some point learn to be a more complete WR
Hagen is a good backup and solid on special teams
Hixon is a good backup and solid not great as a returner
Where and when Beckum plays will be interesting
My 2 Cents:
1. Smith
2. Hixon/Manningham
3. Nicks
4. Barden
Fan's Creed: (Play well+Win=Praise) (Play Well+Lose=Praise) (Play Lousy+Win=Criticism) (Play lousy+Lose & Bandwagon Jumpers=Off with thier heads!)
by LoNJDTechnology on May 31, 2010 10:24 PM EDT reply actions
Only because Hixon has more expeirence. Also...
I like Hixon’s speed. I think that his special teams performances showed that he has that break away ability that WRs need to beat defenders. The pass play, in which, he dropped the ball against the Eagles in "08 clearly should that.
Fan's Creed: (Play well+Win=Praise) (Play Well+Lose=Praise) (Play Lousy+Win=Criticism) (Play lousy+Lose & Bandwagon Jumpers=Off with thier heads!)
by LoNJDTechnology on Jun 1, 2010 5:58 AM EDT up reply actions
Hixon is unreliable and bad though
he always either drops deep balls or lets the CB intercept them.
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jun 1, 2010 8:52 AM EDT up reply actions
You're right.
Thank God for the option to substitute. Should those inconsistencies present themseles then I would substitute Hixon with Manningham.
Fan's Creed: (Play well+Win=Praise) (Play Well+Lose=Praise) (Play Lousy+Win=Criticism) (Play lousy+Lose & Bandwagon Jumpers=Off with thier heads!)
by LoNJDTechnology on Jun 1, 2010 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions
My Depth Chart
1) Sinorice Moss
2) Amani Toomer
3) Converted WR Jeremy Shockey
4) Ike Hilliard
5) Plaxico’s Gun
Introducting: Jason Fear-Paul
by BigBlueIntervention on May 31, 2010 11:07 PM EDT reply actions
really?
for 2, 3, and 4 i would’ve thrown in Tim Carter, Jamaar Taylor, and Ron Dixon.
….not bad though
Smith, Nicks, Manningham.
All 3 have versatility. So depth chart? Nah… 1a, 1b, 1c. Barden/Hixon should be 4, hopefully its Barden.
And to those that don’t think Smith drew double teams last year….lol.
"What's your plan?? Rob Fort Knox on elephant back? That's the dumbest thing I ever heard....."
I agree with you Free
people are sleeping on smith and i think barden will be the giants 4 wr on the depth chart, if he continues to improve and have a good training camp and in preseason too
IMO, training camp and their development will sort this out
Smith will be entrenched as the number one. The two will probably depend on Nicks and MM’s developments or improvements that the coaches see fit, which the loser of this battle assumes the three?! The fourth maybe decided by Barden’s development overall, whether it’s his role as a receiver and on ST’s? The Giant’s probably want to use his size, but also want a contribution on ST’s too, so by default, Hixon assumes the fourth (also a returner) and an emergency starter at this point. The fifth will probably be decided by Barden’s development, as Hagan isn’t the mismatch that Barden is.
Overall, it basically will come down to Nick’s, MM and Barden’s developments and improvements!
I'm hoping
1) Nicks
2) Smith
3) Manningham
4) Barden/Beckum
It’s only a matter of time in my eyes until Nicks takes the #1 spot, he’s a REAL talent and will sensational for years to come.
I noticed most BBVers didn’t mention Beckum, and I think this goes back to Ed’s post incorporating those two guys into 4 WR sets or red zone packages.
Also, I debated putting Ham at 2 and Smith at 3 just because Smith seems like the penultimate slot receiver , although realistically they will slide Ham out wide and bring Smith into that spot for 3WR sets.
- Mohamed Sanu: A Giant in Two Years-
I think Beckum could slide into the slot
or even the outside (did it a ton at Wisconsin).
Especially when they slide SS12 to the outside, then move Becks to the slot.
"What's your plan?? Rob Fort Knox on elephant back? That's the dumbest thing I ever heard....."
by FreeBradshaw on Jun 1, 2010 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
I think you will see Buckum as the "TE"
In 3 WR sets. I think he will be slotted to one side and Smith to the other with Nicks and Ham flanked out wide.
probably that too.
If they really know what they’re doing with Beckum, they’ll use him like they use that Clark guy in Indy. All over the place.
Maybe Eli should ask big bro on how to use a player with that skillset?
"What's your plan?? Rob Fort Knox on elephant back? That's the dumbest thing I ever heard....."
The way I see it...
I see Nicks and Manningham being the X and Y, and Smith in the slot, as usual. I see Barden coming in sometimes in 3 WR sets, and mostly in 4 WR sets. Hopefully we’ll utilize his height in the red zone – or at least threaten defenses with it. Hagan will most likely exclusively play special teams. Hixon will see some time at WR, until he drops enough game-changing catches that we’ll have no choice but to sit him when the O is on the field.
yes
it will start that may. half way through the year Mann and Ram flip flop. And smith tries to do his best Wes Welker impersonation minus the YAC..
I hope Nicks is at least half as good as most people here think he will be
Do not forget that he got most of his yards in garbage time against the 2nd stringers.
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jun 1, 2010 10:23 PM EDT reply actions
No
but some people are hyping him up to average 1000 receiving yards per season for the rest of his career which will not happen. Not in this kind of offense.
I think Nicks will probably have 800-900 yards again but hopefully more of those yards will be in clutch situations and other times when we need a spark.
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jun 2, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Yea Mclaren
Trust me Nicks is the truuuuuuuuth, and most of his yards were not in garbage time at all, maybe in the begining but he showed his potential in some big games against the skins and eagles
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
Here you go!!
Base Package:
Nicks (right side)
Smith (left side)
Nickle Package:
Manningham (right side)
Nicks (Left side)
Smith (slot)
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
the three amigos
smith nicks and manningham will be something reminiscent of what the redskins had with art monk, gary clark and ricky sanders. im just hopeful that kevin gilbride utilizes the talent he has and steps up his sometime mundane playcalling
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