New York Giants draft review, 'Kudos & Wet Willies' style
If you have been around long enough to go through a couple of drafts with me, you know I absolutely hate NFL Draft Grades. They are stupid, meaningless and much ado about a whole bunch of stuff no one knows anything about yet. Since, of course, players have not even gone to rookie mini-camp yet.
Shoot, I'm not even ready to grade the 2009 Giants' draft. There is still way too much to learn about what kind of players Hakeem Nicks, Clint Sintim, Will Beatty, Ramses Barden and Travis Beckum will be to do that with any authority whatsoever. So, try to grade the just-completed 2010 NFL Draft? Forget it. Can't be done with any real meaning.
That said, everybody loves to immediately put their individual stamp of approval, or disapproval, on what teams choose to do with their picks in the NFL Draft. And 'draft grades' seems to be everyone's crutch way of doing it. Giants' fans are no different. 'FreeBradshaw' took a stab at that Sunday, and I referenced several posts from mainstream writers offering their opinions of what General Manager Jerry Reese and Director of Scouting Marc Ross decided to do with the Giants' seven selections.
So, there is only one way I know of to give a complete review of the Giants' draft. That, as you might have guessed by now, is to look back at it in Big Blue View's signature style, with a 'Kudos & Wet Willies' post.
So, here we go. Let's go selection by selection, and give each pick a 'Kudos' or a 'Wet Willie.'
Round 1, Jason Pierre-Paul. DE, South Florida
I summed up my feelings about this selection Friday morning. I was less than thrilled when the pick was announced, but after getting away from the emotional reaction I am very happy about what Reese tried to accomplish here. Rather than settle for 'probably good', he took a risk and aimed for 'possibly great.'
Here is some of what I wrote the other day.
This is what I really like about the selection of Pierre-Paul. With Rolando McClain and C.J. Spiller off the board, Reese still swung for the home run. There were safer options, and clearly selecting Morgan, Mike Iupati, Bryan Bulaga or a handful of other players who were still available might have been an easier pick for the fan base to swallow.
Yet, Reese did not do the safe thing and I admire him for it. To be great, you have to be willing to accept risk, to swing for the home run on occasion. It's how Ernie Accorsi swung the deal that brought Eli Manning to New York in 2004. Reese had the courage to go for greatness.
I will stand by that. We just have to wait and see what happens with JPP. To be honest, we aren't likely to see much in 2010, though he may flash occasionally if and when he gets opportunities as a pass rusher. It's what we see in 2011 and beyond that will determine the wisdom of this selection.
By the way, if you have not read it yet you have to check out Ralph Vacchiano's outstanding profile of JPP.
-- Kudos
Round 2, Linval Joseph, DE, East Carolina
My absolute favorite pick of the draft by General Manager Jerry Reese. I have been beating the drum for a potentially dominant, run-stuffing force ever since we began discussing the draft nearly three months ago. I just believe that a dominating player inside who commands a double-team can make everyone around him a better player. The Giants did not have a guy like that in 2009, and probably have not had one in a long time. That is not a knock on Fred Robbins, but Robbins was more of a pass-rush guy than an impenetrable force against the run.
In his initial press conference as a Giant Joseph said "I like to stop the run. I like to hit the running back, I don't why. I just like to hit the running back."
Reese summed up Joseph this way.
"Gigantic Man. That's where I can start with him. He's a big human being. He's powerful inside and a run stuffer. Push the pocket back toward the quarterback. Strong kid with a lot of upside ... He is a load inside and it's hard to push this man back. He is kind of like one of those guys who is a presence and is like a human post. He'll give the linebackers a chance to run to the ball and he will block the inside."
I have a feeling Giants' fans are going to love this guy.
-- Kudos
Round 3, Chad Jones, S, LSU
I thought this was a great value for the Giants, especially since I figured this was a player who could justifiably been off the board somewhere in the second round. We knew going into the draft that, even having signed two free-agent safeties, the Giants would likely try to add another as long-term protection for Kenny Phillips.
Jones was also a closer on LSU's baseball team, and the fact that he has never fully concentrated on football leads you to think there is a lot of untapped ability there.
"I didn't get as much football maybe that I think would make me a better player. I think now that I'm focusing on football year round, I think you're going to see the best of me," Jones said. "I feel that the best is yet to come. I think I had some good games at LSU and I had some strong points. But I think there is so much more to see what I have."
Here is Director of Scouting Marc Ross summarizing Jones' skill set.
Chad is a young, versatile player. He is a safety who plays in the box, and they play him deep. He returns punts. I don't know if you guys know but he plays baseball, too. This kid has a nice, versatile skill set of things that he can do. He's a big kid...221 pounds, 6'2". He can run and he's strong.
"The way we use our guys, they have to be able to do a little bit of everything. And he fits right in with that. Because that is the way they used him there. You see him up in the box like a linebacker, sometimes you see him back deep playing cover two and single-high stuff."
As a safety, all Jones has to do initially is be better than Michael Johnson to be of help to the Giants' defense. In the long run the Giants think he can be a lot more than that, however, and I hope they are right.
-- Kudos
Round 4, Phillip Dillard, MLB, Nebraska
This was one of those picks where, as a fan without all the detailed information the teams have you might have been left scratching your head when the name flashed up on the board Saturday.
I guess as a fan just having the "expert" draft analyst reports to read I thought this was a tad early for Dillard to be selected. Yet, being unable to get Rolando McClain (if they actually wanted him) the Giants needed a middle linebacker to add to their competition. They like what they got.
Here is Ross talking about Dillard.
Phillip is a high energy, fast kind of player. He is a little on the short side but the guy is 245 pounds. He's thick, and we expect him to play in the middle and compete for that job there. He's a smart kid and he's really been a tough worker there at Nebraska so we are excited about him.
The Giants, of course, are looking for a replacement for Antonio Pierce. I'm not the first one to write it, but it is actually stunning how much you can compare Dillard to Pierce. AP was undrafted when he entered the league in 2001, considered not athletic enough. But, made up for physical shortcomings with leadership, study and heart.
Just listen to Dillard, and you think about Pierce.
"I love to be in control of the checks and make the checks. And if you look at our defense, I made all of the checks from blitzes to checking high coverages, to checking man coverages and telling our corners or safeties or dimes what they are going to do and what check to make. That is just something that I love to do. I love to lead and have that on my shoulders, the quarterback of the defense.
"Now that I don't have to worry about classes. I get to watch film even more. So I'm just going to go in there and I'm going to be in there with the coaches, be on his ears and I will probably get on his nerves. "Coach, what do I do here?" I want to know everything, I want to know the in's and out's of everybody that we play, and then go to me watching the film and then me being able to pick out the offensive linemen's stance - is it full; is too high, is it buzzsaw, is he standing on his feet when he backpeddles. Just everything. I watch for every little thing. I really watch film because I love giving a heads up on the players. It makes it look like I'm doing good out there but really I'm just doing my research and I'm playing off of it."
If this guy can duplicate the success AP had during his first few seasons with the Giants this will be looked back upon as a tremendous selection.
-- Kudos
Round 5, Mitch Petrus, OG, Arkansas
I had two thoughts when I saw Petrus' name flash up on my computer screen Saturday afternoon while I was writing and monitoring the draft.
- Goodbye, and good riddance, Adam Koets.
- David Diehl was a fifth-round pick, and he has been a pretty darn good lineman for the Giants. Even if he is miscast as a left tackle.
Ross referred to Petrus' toughness when asked about him, something that Tom Coughlin and Reese repeatedly said was missing from the 2009 Giants. He called him "a tough, nasty, feisty, competitive guy. That's who he is going to be and that is going to be his calling card. ... He is a guy that is going to attack it from day one."
There is no way of knowing right now if Petrus can eventually push Rich Seubert for the starting left guard job. Now way he pushes Chris Snee on the right side. This was classic Giants, though, looking for the big bodies on the offensive line in the middle rounds. Let's hope he has a career as good as Diehl's has been.
-- Kudos
Round 6, Adrian Tracy, OLB, William & Mary
This is a player I knew zilch about, except for the fact that the Giants worked him out, prior to seeing his name pop up with 'Giants' next to it Saturday in the sixth round.
A defensive end at William & Mary, the Giants see him as a player who can transition to outside linebacker.
Here is Reese talking about Tracy.
"He is a really good athlete, really smart kid and big kid. We think he has upside to project to a SAM linebacker and give us some depth at that position."
The Giants see Tracy as a diamond in the rough. At the least, he should provide athleticism and tackling ability on special teams.
My only problem with this pick really has nothing to do with Tracy. It has to do with the guy selected immediately AFTER Tracy. That would be tight end Anthony McCoy, who was snapped up by Seattle. The Giants seem to have a revolving door of free agents who they keep bringing in and hoping can become a blocking tight end. This guy has a reputation as an excellent blocker, could help the Giants in short-yardage and red zone situations and would likely have seen the field a lot more than Tracy will -- at least initially.
-- Wet Willie
Round 7, Matt Dodge, P, East Carolina
First of all, 'kudos' to Jeff Feagles for letting the Giants know before the draft that he is considering retirement. That was a class move that gave the Giants an opportunity to address the punter position in the draft if they wanted to.
Dodge was the third punter drafted over the weekend, yet some rankings listed him as the best punter available in the draft. He averaged better than 45 yards per punt in 2009.
From NFL.com.
Possesses an accurate leg and shows the ability to trap opponents inside the 20-yard line. Versatile punter who can kick off and make some field goals in a pinch. ... Struggles to consistently get good hang time and punts too many line drives past his coverage.
Right now it looks like Dodge will compete with Jy Bond for the punting job, should Feagles decide to retire. Will he have a 20+year career like Feagles? No one knows, but the Giants deserve credit for moving decisively to solve a potential problem.
-- Kudos
Overview
This was a very important draft for the Giants, who have obvious flaws after going 8-8 in 2009 and missing the playoffs for the first time in five years.
Reese had a phenomenal draft in 2007 that helped propel the Giants to the Super Bowl title. He has been good, but not as good, since. Last season there were a few curious selections, like H-Back Travis Beckum and two corners at the end of the draft who did not make the team, and some free-agent miscues.
The franchise needed JR to re-discover the 2007 magic. There is no way to know for sure right now, and maybe not for a couple of years, but I have a feeling this could be Reese's best draft since that amazing 2007 season.
-- Kudos
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Comments
This Is A Strategy?
The “Best Available” draft strategy is like trying to make a meal by going to the market & buying whatever is on sale. It may be a good value but it doesn’t always mix well. We now have 168 defensive lineman & no linebackers. Perhaps opponents will consider quick slant patterns to negate any rush & expose the lack of a linebacking corps? Clint Sintim is looking like William Joseph 2009. The Giants have a need that they didn’t address & it will come back to haunt them the entire season.
Nothing Is Fool proof if you have the right fools.
dont
be so quick to dismiss Clint Sintim. first he went from the collage 3-4 to the pro’s 4-3. That can be hard enough. Also he was playing in a defense that couldnt cover, and had a d-line that wasnt keeping any of the backers clean. Now we have Fewell who can really show Sintim how to play 4-3 sucsessfully, we have a secondary that can cover, and a d-line that should definatly keep our LB’s clean. I think Clint will have a very good year in 2010
Agreed, 56
Sintim is a player to watch this season. The Giants need him to step up, and I believe he will.
by Ed Valentine on Apr 26, 2010 7:05 AM EDT up reply actions
The kids we drafted aren't the only players on our team
We got high quality guys who we can build around. Drafting only for the next season is incredibly near sighted; JR is planning ahead for the future. The Giants’ FO determined there was no real need at LB, just as they (correctly) determined that the rookies and the young vets we had in our WR corp were sufficient last year.
Maybe an offseason to heal and build cohesion will be enough to solidify our linebackers. You and I are amateurs; we couldn’t possibly know. TC and friends know what they’re doing.
My faith was shaken, but now that I’ve had some time to think about it: In JR we trust!
It is not the lack of need at linebacker
It was the lack of value. Is the original poster suggesting we take Lee or Spikes at 15? The Giants pretty much admitted they had Dillard as a 3rd round grade and passed on him because they thought he would drop. That’s the kind of risk people are criticizing Jacksonville for not taking with Alualu. You combine need and value. The Giants addressed all of their needs, and did not reach to do so.
Many people have not heard of Tracy but he had a lot of positive press. Skilled, hard worker, good character. He was identified as a sleeper that some team could take in the 4th or 5th. I hope he gets the chance to play DE as well.
Tracy
Too small for DE. Less than 250 pounds. Giants have already told the guy he is strictly an outside linebacker.
by Ed Valentine on Apr 26, 2010 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions
And all of our DEs are big. Being small gives him a different look. Someone that can duck under the tackle. Like Freeney.
bigDe's???
OSi ways about 255 lbs..Forget what the Gameday guide says. Just look at him.
Yeah Osi is 255
but its a slimmer build, Tuck only weighs 7 more pounds but he looks way bigger and so does sintim, Tracy is a heavy 250, I think tracy can play DE no problem, they just put him at SAM because appearently our Sam has to have DE skills on this team
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
he looks big tho...
I remember last year when seeing Sintim for the first time..of cours wearing that #97, i thought it was Kiwi.
Looking at some videos of Tracy in pads, the guy looks bigger then his listed 6"3 250lbs.
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
Is Sintim going back to #55 since Danny left???
cause Linval has been given #97!
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
sintim
is wearing 52 this season, boley 59, wilkenson 58
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
for #58
they should probably take “wide load” off of the jersey
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Damn Free
Pierce was one of best damn players chill
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
GiantsCauseway..response..
Agree with your statement.
For some reason. Jerry Rease does not value College Linebackers at all. I don’t know, Brian Cushing did pretty well last year. He keeps thinking LB’s are not worth more than a 4th round pick. And we keep thinking College DE’s can play LB.. In a 4 -3 THEY CAN’T. Kiwanuku was a disaster. Sintim did nothing. You’re right. We have a full defense of Defensive Ends. Most of which can not stop the run, outside of Tuck. Now we all realize how important Strahan was against the run. The league also knows OSI was exposed now, without Stray..
Back to our linebackers. Jonathan Goff STINKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Watch the games from last year. We play a linebacker who CAN’T tackle. I truly don’t get it.
Another problem is, colleges are not producing 4-3 linebackers. NFL teams are continually switching to 3-4’s due to many things, but one, the lack of LB talent. Maybe we should eventually go where the talent is and start thinking of a 3-4. I think that Defense kind of worked for us in the late 80’s, don’t you think???
No linebackers you say?
I disagree to the nth degree. Yes nth degree. We have depth, but if you look at how the Giants have had success, you will notice that it starts up front with the Dline. Last year we attempted to bolster the line with the FA signings of Bernard and Canty. Canty was dealing with injuries as well as Bernard coming out after the season stating he played injured. Couple this with Jay Alford on IR for the entire season. That leave Cofield and Freddie Robbins. Robbins is aging and the signs have shown that he struggled more. Makes sense all the DT depth was injured. How can a 300 lb man be effective without a subs, especially in the 4th quarter. So in reality Cofield was the only effective DT we had last year. Moving on to the ends. Osi takes a wide loop to the QB but it’s only effective when the DT gets a push. They didn’t which neutralized Osi’s strengths. Justin Tuck played injured, eff you Flozell, since game 2! Kiwi did a solid job but after him where’s the depth? Tollefson is not a household name, he is a rotational at best substitute. Our LB crew got exposed because we got no push on the LOS. Take back the LOS and penetrate it. Force the QB to make mistakes. I don’t know how many games you watched last year, but the Giants got no push, and no pass rush. Brees, McNabb, Romo, Farve, Rivers those 5 QBs picked us apart last year because they had all day to stand there and go threw their reads. Our LBs will look much better this year with a healthy dominant Dline. You can read my fanpost on our Revamped Dline for any further argument you want to address.
With my scant knowledge of the college game,
I don’t feel competent to start handing out kudos and wet willies. I agree with your assessment of JPP and overall am quite pleased with the players chosen. I’m hopeful they’ll all contribute to our success this year. I fully expect moves from JR before/during traing camp.
George
My assessment is based more on the theory of what the Giants were trying to accomplish than anything else. No one knows how any of the players will turn out.
by Ed Valentine on Apr 26, 2010 7:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Big thanks to Free
The draft was certainly more enjoyable and we gained alot of knowledge about players we picked, did not pick or missed because of the research that Free carried out for us.
So thanks Free and I hope you have the time to do it again next year.
by G Fan in England on Apr 26, 2010 7:11 AM EDT reply actions
no problem G Brit
tho in my ‘official mock’ getting one pick right….I dunno man.
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 7:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Ahh
but one wrong player normally equates to two teams wrong.
by G Fan in England on Apr 26, 2010 7:31 AM EDT up reply actions
You cant look at it like that
You cant really account for the players you mock that are taken before the Giants picked, I got only one right as well and that was a pure guess.
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
You also kept us laughing
well at least me anyways. good look.
Creed: (Play well-Win=Praise) (Play Well-Lose=Praise) (Play Lousy-Win=Criticism) (Play lousy-Lose/Bandwagon Jumpers=Off with thier heads!)
by LoNJDTechnology on Apr 26, 2010 11:01 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Giants really seemed to go with character and smarts with all these players
Anthony McCoy tested positive for the weeeed before the draft, and even guys like Jon Dwyer have medical conditions where they gotta take amphetamines, so that’s a good reason they passed there. And of course LeGarrette Blount.
I wouldn’t be surprised all thse guys were crossed off their list. Even Sean Weatherspoon in the first round, maybe they were one of those teams that crossed him off.
I think Reese made his killing again after round 1. Barring injury, most of these guys should play.
Still worried a bit on that JPP pick. I like to think of him as an elite athlete. This thing makes me wonder if he’s just an elite athlete, not an elite DE athlete like the ones mentioned there.
Or maybe he’s raw in the weightroom too?
JPP
will come down to his desire to succeed and the Giants coaching staff pressing the right buttons.
by G Fan in England on Apr 26, 2010 7:30 AM EDT up reply actions
So here is a question
If California legalizes marijuana, will the California players not get suspended for it?
by mypisceannature on Apr 26, 2010 8:04 AM EDT up reply actions
depends on if its considered a performance enhancer
I’d like to see Gilbride on it so he can get creative with his playcalls
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 8:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Or Not
I don’t want to see Eli lining up wide and Snee throwing the ball to him.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
JPP
Those metrics are terrible huh? Hopefully it’s a case of being raw in the weight room! At any rate, JPP has a LOT of catching up to do … in the weight room, in film & playbook study, and on-field experience. We’re going to have to give this kid some time.
yea..
the fact that metric seems to be correct most of the time..it predicted Justin Tuck and Jared Allen to be great, is enough to cause night sweats.
Either way..its just a predictor. I really don’t think its an all inclusive list either, so I’d like to see if there were any there that it said will suck, who didn’t.
The numbers JPP put up at the combine say he’s not really a physical freak..actually (at least not in the sense that DeMarcus Ware or Jevon Kearse are/were).
I ain’t gonna jump off that building just yet….but I’m ordering a few parachutes.
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 8:42 AM EDT up reply actions
didi it predict them or
did it see who was successful and bend it’s numbers to match. There are alot of names not listed here
I think its measuring explosion
which well…if its saying JPP’s got no explosion, that’s a friggin lie and a half. You watch him on tape and he flies up field like he’s got the clicker from click and put everyone on pause…raw or not, he’s got explosion.
So who knows. It doesn’t like JPP. It likes Jerry Hughes. I think Hughes will be good too (went to the right team too). But maybe JPP went to the right team as well?
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
don't worry about Sackseer
the thing doesn’t seem to hold much water in my book. Stats, stats, blah blah blah… lets see what he does once were in camp.
Like they say, "Talk is cheap. Play the game". September can't come soon enough.
I mean it. Summer is a bitch down here in South Florida and it’s already started.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Yeah
It’s exactly the sabermetrics vs scouts debate that Bill Simmons talked about in his mock draft column. The stats geeks at Outsiders say JPP will be a bust, but Mike Lombardi says the guy has unlimited potential. We’ll see who wins that battle.
Here’s the link (he had Tennessee drafting him): http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/100420
Or
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
statistics
“There are lies, damn lies and statistics.” Mark Twain
"Never trust a quote attributed to Mark Twain"
-Mark Twain
Your quote is actually by Benjamin Disraeli, but it’s a good one.
by SonictheHedgecock on Apr 26, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Even with time to think I do not like the JPP pick
15 is to high in the draft to gamble! Reese should have traded down once McClain and Spiller were gone. I really don’t like the pick, but than again I killed Ernie for the Eli trade too. Also seems none of this kids will come in and help immediatle everyone of them is a project of some sorts including Joseph.
What really bothers me is our linebackers, No disrespect to Dillard, but I just can’t get excieted about another late round linebacker, in fact I would say before the draft linebacker was our weakest position on the whole team. Now that the draft is over linebacker is still our weakest position on the teaam. Seems JR does not value linebackers at all. I guess he will waive the 1 year 1 million dollar contract around and see if he can hit lightning in the bottle again.
I don’t see these guys really helping for 2 to 3 years.
by Late for Dinner on Apr 26, 2010 7:31 AM EDT reply actions
Ralph Vacchiano's outstanding profile of JPP
Gave me a much better insight to what this kid is and what he is all about
I still think he is a bit of gamble at 15 but could go down as one of our best first rounders in years.
From community college football to the first round in the draft…his determination and natural skill got him through a lot of adversity, now he has for the first time ever a real support system in the Giants coaching staff to help him achieve greatness.
and I know this is a bit of a stretch but he did not start plying football until his junior year in high school like that other first rounder we took years ago….that 56 guy
You can see a lot just by observing-Yogi Berra
I read
Ralph V’s article, what concerns me is the numerous broken legs in high school?
I know the kid is the backflip king, but you wonder about these broken legs down the road?
by Great Gatsby on Apr 26, 2010 8:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Courage..
It’s how Ernie Accorsi swung the deal that brought Eli Manning to New York in 2004. Reese had the courage to go for greatness…
Ed, that is an apples to oranges comparison, and I think you would know that.
A franchise QB compared to a project, albeit very gifted athletically.
I know that
But it illustrated the point. JPP was not the easy pick, or the safest. It was the ‘go for broke’ pick.
by Ed Valentine on Apr 26, 2010 8:12 AM EDT up reply actions
True
But I wouldn’t say Eli’s situation showed courage, they still would have wound up with
Rivers or Not So Gentle Ben.Let’s face it, at that point they had gone as far as they could go with Kerry Collins, then brought in Warner to keep the seat warm.
by Great Gatsby on Apr 26, 2010 8:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Well
In that case the easy thing to do would have been to ‘settle’ for Rivers or Big Ben. Accorsi thought he saw something more in Eli, so he took the risk and made the deal. The JPP situation is not totally the same, obviously, it’ just that there were easier, safer choices for JR to make. That’s what made me think of the comparison.
by Ed Valentine on Apr 26, 2010 8:22 AM EDT up reply actions
Eli wsn't that big a risk
or a risk at all really. He was seen by most as the best QB prospect of the class. Rivers was a bigger risk because he had an unconventioanl throwing motion as was Big dumb Ben because he came froma different competition level. Accorsi traded up for the more solid prospect. It would have been comparible if we traded up for McClain or something like that. Sitting at 15 and taking JPP would have been equivalent to Accorsi sitting pat and taking Rivers or Ben. If anything Reese behaved opposite of Accorsi.
the risk
was moving up to get him. and that some were saying he was living off his brothers name. and that he didnt take over games
Toney does what the douglas do. And no one can do what he does b/c doing it without being Toney Douglas just doesnt make it do what it do
Then again, I think the comparison stands because Accorsi was gambling with a very high (the highest) impact position and was courageous enough to go after Manning in such a high-stakes scenario. For JPP, Reese displayed the same sort of courage (i.e. going after a player that is risky but who he believes in); however, it is in less of a high-risk, make or break position. It is still a high pick to risk, but having McClain and Spiller off the board opened up the JPP choice for Reese.
interesting that dude says, that Marc Ross says
JPP was the #6 rated player on the board. Just assuming, but Suh, McCoy, Okung, Berry, McClain, JPP?
Or maybe Spiller was in there over one of them (who cares now…)? If the people that matter say JPP is the #6 overall player…that means this guy is a steal.
Who the hell cares what Russ Landing, or Wes Bunting, or Mel Kiper..say about this guy?
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions
I read that this morning and would have posted the same link if I woke up earlier this morning.
I live down in the area where JPP grew up and know the director of an automotive training facility in his neighborhood who knows him and went to his HS games. Deerfield Beach is actually one of the better High School Football teams down here, and if you know anything about Florida HS Football, you know that it’s as insanely a feverish obsession as it is in Texas. He said JPP was the most noticeable player on the field. He was always standing out among the entire field and was incredibly disruptive. He also said that he is the nicest kid you ever want to meet and that makes his beast like performance a little shocking if you ignore his scary size and focus on the person inside.
Either way it’s a gamble, but one worth betting on. Toughness and natural skills can’t be taught and JPP has those traits in abundance.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
JPP will be fine for the simple fact
that he gets to learn from Tuck, Kiwi, Canty, Osi, Nunn, Fewell, he can draw from Sintims experience so far as well, the kid is in the perfect organization, he doesnt have to start, he will be around the most competition he has been ever and if you do your research, he always out competes his best competition and plays big in the biggest games. I love the JPP pick, especially now, good job Reese
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
J.P.P Dammit, Brian Price, John Jerry, Jamar Chaney, Deji Karim, Kenny Alfred, Rafael Priest....... April 22-24th.
Spot on Gates
This pick was for the future. All rookies need time to learn a new system, strategies, assignments, reads. You cannot really expect any rookie to come in and make a huge difference. There were no MLBs at 15. So why didn’t we trade up for RoMac? Answer we would have given up to much for a position that is not considered to be high value. Spoon is not a MLB period. Terrible value at 15. Sean Lee and Spikes you say? If they made it to the 3rd round. Just because they are considered the 2nd and 3rd best MLBs in the draft doesn’t mean squat. That doesn’t make any difference in the NFL. No one cares how good you were in college. It how you will do in a Pro system with the best of the best players in the world. You don’t have Northwestern or Baylor to dominate, making your stats inflatable and fallous. Value in the 4th was there with Dillard. So we snatched who we had ranked as the 2nd best LB in the group, because he fits the Giants scheme.
I think McClain was definetly in his top 6
I dont think Okung was over Earl Thomas just based on a need grade
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
J.P.P Dammit, Brian Price, John Jerry, Jamar Chaney, Deji Karim, Kenny Alfred, Rafael Priest....... April 22-24th.
Believe it or not, I don't believe ET was even near that high on their board if he even was at all
The only rub on ET was that he needs to improve on his tackling skills. We all know that ability is at a premium on the Giants. Safety is also traditionally low on the position value scale with most GM’s saying they rarely consider one in the first round.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
yea...
I can’t see how a premier LT was not on the Giants radar.
Then again, they seem to avoid the OL like the plague in the draft until the 2nd round at least.
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions
I believe they don't want to pay a rookie OT what they would have to at a high pick.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
No sun!!
that was the rub on him compared to Berry!! I think he was right in the Giants top picks, he needs to improve his tackling yes, but he is more ed reed than polumalu so I dnt think that something that would make the G’z avoid him, think about it! had Berry not been in the Draft ET’s value wouldve been even higher, I understant Okung but I dnt think they had him on there.
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
I thought u said
" Believe it or not, I don’t believe ET was even near that high on their board if he even was at all", Im saying I think he was for sure and that his knock of him not being a tackler was only compared to Berry, in the realm of football he is a good tackler but when compared to Berry’s tackling he is not close to him in that respect but maybe i got confused, my bad.
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
Now I get you, but mentioning ET even in the same sentence as Reed or Polamalu is just plain silly.
I still don’t think the Giants were targeting ANY safety that high per the same philosophy that’s shared among most of the league’s brain trust.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Yeah
I heard that the other night, in the press conference, was surprised..I’d say Spiller in the top six, along with Suh, McCoy, Berry, McClain, and JPP, just taking a stab here.
I hope so...
I could imagine if McCLain wasn’t in that top 6…..there might be mass suicide if he chose JPP over McClain.
Either way, I don’t think since JR’s been here, he’s gotten the #6 overall player to him. Regardless of what we all and anyone else thinks or sees about JPP….that’s gotta count for something. We got the 6th best player in the draft.
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 8:58 AM EDT up reply actions
Ok, had some time to digest
First and foremost, I won’t second guess JR and his scouting team until they start going all Al Davis on us (btw Raiders really surprised me…really liked their draft…they drafted like us!). So, if these are the guys they took, then I’ll be more than happy w/ their choices. That said, my two pennies.
JPP: Ton of potential and he’ll have a lot of good guys to learn from. He’ll be able to contribute early w/o having to take over for a year or two.
Linval: I, too, love this pick. He’s gonna eat up a lot of space. I see our rotation a whole lot healthier w/ these first two picks.
CJ: adds some depth to a new look secondary. I already feel multitudes better about this group then last year’s (not like it could get much worse).
Dillard: I don’t know much about him, but maybe a lil competition is what Goff needs to prosper.
Petrus: Kinda exciting prospect. He can learn a lot from the guys we got, and can always use another lineman.
Tracy: Yeah, I don’t know squat about this kid. But if they’re looking for ST contributions, than by all means.
Dodge: At first I wwas like, wha? Didn’t Feagles just sign a contract. But after hearing TC and JR, yeah, this was a very smart move.
Want more...
The draft was OK, as Ed says, we will see. JPP is a question (duh!), Joseph is my best hope. I’d like to see them bring Rashawn Jackson (FB) to camp. Have not seen anyone grab him yet. Hedgecock is a decent to good blocker but manos de piedras like Roberto Duran. We need some backfield passing threat, don’t really have one. How about trying Beckum out back there from time to time? Don’t know, just a thought. Not a fulltime FB but worth a try. Can we see some more suggestions for FAs and improving the team from the group?
by UnknownJintsFan on Apr 26, 2010 9:03 AM EDT reply actions
I keep having this thought
About Pierre-Paul, Osi, Kiwi, Tuck and Sintim on the field at the same time to do nothing more than take the head off a quarterback.
President of the Ramses Barden Fan Club
Where do you think we will see JPP make an impact this year??
I really cant see him him having a big role on D this year
With the pathetic shape of our special teams coverage last year (not to mention the fact we still have not addressed the special teams coaching)
Do you see him as a special teams guy….we could use the help
You can see a lot just by observing-Yogi Berra
Nickle has over 1000 snaps a year
even more as the NFL passes more, the kid will get on the field dnt foget you can pretty much do what you want with JPP, Kiwi,Tuck & Sintim as far as stand up and hands dwn rushing, so he will play alot in my estimation.
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
J.P.P Dammit, Brian Price, John Jerry, Jamar Chaney, Deji Karim, Kenny Alfred, Rafael Priest....... April 22-24th.
McCoy
Looked like he was stoned at the combine. Worst performer out of the TEs, looked like he did not care to be there. Inconsistent in college. I had him dropping to the 4th/5th round before the positive drug test.
They cut him cuz of his attitude and cuz he kinda stinks
not much upside there either cuz he’s old. Doesn’t sound like the sort the Giants will bring in.
Plus with Adrian Tracy here…I’d rather see AT make the squad
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Yea Tracy makes the squad easy
AT doesnt suck IMO, he is just un motivated, maybe a return to B more in a limited role is what he needs plus he would play DE for us and were all stocked there right now
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
J.P.P Dammit, Brian Price, John Jerry, Jamar Chaney, Deji Karim, Kenny Alfred, Rafael Priest....... April 22-24th.
John Henderson
got dropped by Jacksonville and its rumored that the Giants have been looking into him, any thoughts?
by downtownbrown77 on Apr 26, 2010 10:36 AM EDT reply actions
aside from attitude
the same reasons for Adalius Thomas being a no…no to Henderson.
If anything the Giants are gonna cut some veterans. They’re going younger for our new DC to coach up.
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
rather give Collins an outside shot
Henderson did nothing last year or maybe two. Hence Jacksonville drafts two DTs.
this is why i love BBV:
My only problem with this pick really has nothing to do with Tracy. It has to do with the guy selected immediately AFTER Tracy. That would be tight end Anthony McCoy, who was snapped up by Seattle. The Giants seem to have a revolving door of free agents who they keep bringing in and hoping can become a blocking tight end. This guy has a reputation as an excellent blocker, could help the Giants in short-yardage and red zone situations and would likely have seen the field a lot more than Tracy will — at least initially.
^
People with real views, ideas, and solutions….
i too was looking for a blocking TE….
I even got excited about the prospect of the Giants moving Guy Whimper…..until I heard the rumblings were to move him to G. I just think a blocking TE is a NEED here. Whimper will never be a OT, or a G (let’s face facts)….but what about letting him help boss out in short yardage situations
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
Generally I agree with Ed's summary of the draft...
But I’ll disagree and go with the “Wet Willie” on the Jason Pierre-Prospect pick. Hopefully the Giants arean’t picking this high anytime soon again. It was a chance to bring in an impact player, and MAYBE Reese has done that. Then again, maybe he’s traded the #15 pick for the mystery that’s behind door #2. I’m gonna hope that Reese is right, and I’m going to cheer for JPP to dominate, but I still don’t like the pick, and to me it’s nothing like picking Eli. In that situation if you won, you got a franchise quarterback, if you lost, you got a very good NFL starter at quarterback. At least I think that was more akin to the feeling at the time. In this case, if you win, JPP becomes a disruptive force at DE, if you lose, he becomes a very tall, fast, athletic addition to the unemployment line. I hope I’m wrong, and I hope JPP does well, but until proven wrong, I’m not ready to say “kudos” on that pick just yet.
Well a rare (very rare) I told you so from me..
I told you guys that I started liking this JPP because he had a scary look about him..I believe my comment was something like..He’s a guy who they would have to hide his helmet from to keep him out of the game..Well…then Ralphs column showed up a couple of days later..They didn’t have to hide his helmet, they cut it in pieces and had to find him a new one, after he showed back up on the field with his goddamn release papers from the Doctors..I am now a big fan of JPP..He went from having to be dragged on the field to being dragged off of it..He is going to be real special real fast..
Joseph..I like the fact that he likes to hit runners..Hey that is your job, glad you like to do that..Show us, your a house..Dillard..He’s another scary looking dude..I like linebackers that when you look at them straight in the eyes, you swear their eyes are focussed on people to the left and right of them and not you..thats the mark of a LB..This Dodge guy sounds like a good replacement for Feagles (a class act that will be tough to follow)..but in all the years I have watched this game..No team sends their punter downfield to whack a returner..they lay back as a last resort..We don’t want ‘last resorts’..Having said that let’s see how good he is punting the ball..and maybe they can stick him into certain situations where he can get his bell rung…Petrus..he’ll be a animal someday, but I still think our OL is solid..Learn and be ready bud..Jones..Love that one..Wants to return kicks?..okay Chad go for it and don’t let them get up..I don’t care if you return a kick 2 yards…lay them out..
Now having said all of that, I am biased and like most lemmings, I’ll follow my leaders to the cliff and jump..but the thing I like about our draft this year is the fact that nobody..nobody is talking about it..that is a good sign to me…I think our team is exactly where I want them to be..under the radar screen..
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
My thoughts on how draft should be used..and i think the giants proved it
The draft. Look. I dont follow college football closely enough to know who the great players are or who the second tier guys are and who may be sleepers. I’m an NFL fan. I watch the giants and want them to do well and win Super Bowls. Its where my football dollar goes and it will continue to go. That being said the draft is important.
Important in the fact that i believe a team, the giants, should draft for need and depth. The giants did that this year. A DE, a DL, Linebacker, and secondary help were all taken by the G-men and i applaud the selections. Obviously the giants biggest weakness was defense last year. It looked sluggish most of the season and really hindered the potential to a winning season.
The offense looked great. Outside of the running game but if the guys are to believed, they were banged up. I’ll let a one year slip up slide on their behalf. Our WR’s stepped up and played great. A season under their belts can only improve their effectiveness.
The giants are a good drafting team and they really looked over last season i feel and drafted need. When your a good football team thats what you should do. Draft for need to compliment the free agent pick ups. I dont know if the draftees will be good but with the look and holes on the overall roster i’m pleased. Lets hope they can play.
"The Mets are my favorite squadron." Apu
We have one big mouth on our team at this point..Osi..
He must be feeling like HE just got drafted again..I don’t know about you guys, but I say get rid of him..He doesn’t fit the New York/Jersey Giants profile..just cut his butt..I don’t care…You listen to what a guy like KP says about being a Giant…then that dope..I had to leave yesterday to coach my little league team.I had a kid playing left-field and he basically dropped everything that went his way..He in the 4th inning walked off the field crying his eyes out..I ran up to him and gave him a big hug and told him that we all have tough days..and then put my arm around him and walked him back to the dug-out..You know what this kids Father sitting in the bleachers said?..“What the F is wrong with you !!”..If looks could kill..I told that idiot that he is my star left-fielder..just needs somebody to toss the ball around with him once in awhile…Anyway, point is..nobody is larger than life in any sport at any level or any venue for that matter..That kids Father is right where he belongs, on the bleachers..Osi needs to get lost..we don’t need him..That little kid will play left-field for me anyday.
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
Finally someone from my mock got signed!!
Michael Greco S UCF was signed as a UDFA
Some of you may be happy to know that Mica Johnson is coming in on a try out basis.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Mica Johnson
would be more exciting if not for all the knee injuries. Is he just another Wilk you have to wonder? Don’t know much about Greco.
Micah Johnson coming in is an excellent move.
Really surprised he went UDFA..let alone took so long to get snatched up…let alone, coming in only on a tryout basis.
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Sounds like Ed likes joesph better than robbins
I do too…….for the same reasons ed pointed out….. the giants need a big run stopper and someone that can push the pocket……robbins was a good player for the giants but he was better as a pass rusher and the giants have enough pass rushers on the team and need a player that can command double teams at times and make other players better and their jobs easier too.
Linval ran a 4.93 at his pro day.
Regardless of the thought of what that means….not many 328lbs men on Earth can do that. And of course he’s got that whole weight lifting thing.
But hopefully..just like Petrus, these dudes get banned from the bench press and use that strength to help them do some squats. Get some explosion.
Speaking of that….that’s a big thing for JPP to do. Who knows how much this kid was in the weight room.
All three of our DL’s should be doing the same drills. Get some explosion.
Also, follow Justin Tuck around more then Osi.
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Different players, that's all
Robbins was more of a pass-rush guy. Joseph looks more like a pure run anchor.
by Ed Valentine on Apr 26, 2010 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
he was also great at jumping offsides
by TheBXRepresenta on Apr 26, 2010 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Petrus will first see action as the blocking tight
Petrus was a tight end for a while before becoming a linemen, I predict he will first see action as a blocking tight end for the Giants.
given his experience as a TE
I’d say so.
From the scouting reports, this dude is just inconsistent and needs coaching…so if he gets that he’s as good as any OG in this draft.
I expect him to do something for us. Maybe that’s start at LG? Who knows. If so then if they keep Seubert around, I’d say he does that (I don’t think they’d release Seubert….)
by FreeBradshaw on Apr 26, 2010 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
He wins the LG spot
he wants it to bad, actually reminds me of Seubert with that attitude, Seubert is always the first one to fight in mini camp and I think this guy Petrus will continue the tradition when Richie goes
Peyton May Have The Wins!!
But Eli Will Have The Rings!!!
Seubert played as a goal line TE
before he got the starting job when Diehl moved to LT, so I’d say that is a good guess of how it would go for Petrus too.
Henderson and Thomas would both help this team
They were both released.
Hey, its an uncapped year, give them big short-team deals and see what happens….
I keep hearing that its a risky pick but every pick in the first round is a risky pick. The only question is do you take possibly good over possibly great. I see a lot of people crying to Derrick Morgan but who says he’ll be good. He had a great year in the ACC … which as a league last year was terrible. The highest drafted offensive lineman in the ACC was drafted in the 4th round and he’s a “project”.
If you needed a guy to step in right now and start or at least play a lot of snaps you take Morgan but if you don’t then you take the guy who you think will be the best player in 2-3 years.
by TheBXRepresenta on Apr 26, 2010 11:24 PM EDT reply actions

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