I saw Cornellius Griffin was dumped by the Redskins. I thought always thought he is a strong 2 gaper…What do you think aboyt getting him and going with Eds pick of Morgan?

For all the reasons you stated. Kiwi has had opportunities and has not demonstrated that he has what it takes to be a starter or that he fits in long term. If Osi struggles again (likely). he will complain again, and the Giants will have to get rid of him – I still think they should do it now, while he can be presented as a malcontent and not as damaged goods, and while they can get something in this year’s draft, instead of next year’s.
Does this pick put pressure on you to go DT in the second round, leaving ILB for later?

I applaud the choice as the non-traditional. I expect a lot would look at this and say “we have great players there”. We might. Osi may come in a year after his knee surgery and be motivated. Kiwi may come in ready to be a terror. However, with no stud available at a position of need (DT, S, OT), I’m always a big fan of bolstering the trenches.

When you can bolster the trenches, and add the BPA, you’ve probably done a good job.

I’m ready to make the PITT pick anytime :)

Morgan is an exciting player who should fit our system like a dream because of all the qualities listed above: measurables, versatility, work ethic, relentlessness. Does remind of a healthy, hungry Tuck. We’ll see how the other DEs come back this year, but regardless Morgan could be the best of the bunch.

a) hes the best available defensive player

b) de is more of a need than alot of people realize, for multiple reasons, the trade and fa possibilities ed listed, and also because when we do slide tuck inside on passing downs, we can still have a fresh guy to bring in on the outside that is a huge step up from tollefson

that and im not a big spoon or price fan, so eh, this is the least of the evils

I’m not burning a 1st round pick, let alone a #15 pick on just a rotational player. That picke better be a player I expect to be a starter by his second year at a minimum. This was the deal with Nicks, and Phillips.

The only way you could justify this pick is by planning to get rid of both Kiwi and Osi, which I just don’t see happening. I have faith in Kiwi, and I believe the coachign staff does too. Osi is the one who most liekly moves along as he is the older player. Kiwi is now in that perfect young veteran age. He would have already been money last year if it wasn’t for the year of position change. That offset his development by a year. He’ll be right on track now. Kiwi will get a new deal this year and be our true full fledged starter, meaning Morgan is no more than a rotational player. We can get depth at DE for less than a #15. If you take Morgan here you will be letting go of both Kiwi and Osi which means next year you are going have to draft a DE again to get back your numbers! JUst how many picks for how many years are we going to use on DEs? I know we love the pass rush, but come on man.

The whole BPA thing is way overhyped too. Almost no GM actually does BPA, at least not in the 1st round. Grabbing that 6th rounder that you really don’t need but was just such a great value is one thing. If you take a guy in the 1st and pay him 1st money he better have a spot on your team. Resse does not do BPA in round 1. There are players that would have been BPA over both Nicks and Phillips, but we had a need at those positions. Reese drafts where need intersects value. Morgan doesn’t fit that description. He’s all value, no need. Reese would either say Spoon is adequate value intersecting a need (Spoon will go no later than 24, so it is NOT a reach), or if he for some reason has him graded out lower than the rest of the world he says there is no value that intersects need and looks to trade down.

it seems is in such a hurry to trade Osi, dump Osi, etc. why not let this play out a bit first?
There is a new DC in town, let’s wait and see how he Osi acts or reacts come training camp. Lest we forget, Strahan wasn’t always a model citizen around here, but he ended up playing here 15 years, and Osi is what 28?

to vote on? …..like maybe: Ed I disagree, but you’re NOT an idiot……I could use similar arguments to defend my choice which is Earl Thomas. We are not stacked at this position and Phillips’ situation is far more tenuous than Osi and Kiwi. ET, I like that, is very young and , at the least, could do for our secondary what Morgan could do for our crowded DL.

     I voted for Morgan in the poll, I would have taken him given the choices that were out there, and I’d feel like I’d won the lottery doing it. The Giants got one of the top ten prospects in the draft with the #15 position. If things do sift out this way, I’ll be happy if Reese makes the same move. Osi may be what we saw last year. If he is, we don’t want him starting and he’ll talk his way off the team if he isn’t. If he’s better, but not dominating, he’ll be unhappy about how he’s being used, and a useful player if he shuts up and gone if he doesn’t. And if he dominates, we have either exceptionaly depth or a wonderful trading position. I wanted a defensive upgrade, and while Price is a better situational fit, he’s not the player Morgan is. Spoon is an even better situational pick, IF he’s a middle linebacker in the NFL, which is possible but not a certainty, and way too much of a gamble with the #15 pick to take. Safety had already been upgraded with Rolle and there are other rounds to fill out the needs. With Morgan you have a top ten talent, without a ton of motivational or off field issues who isn’t being asked to change positions, roles or personality. Just to go out and do what he’s been doing when he’s told to do it. Excellent pick Ed, as the poll numbers were going to be against you no matter who you took, and while Morgan may not be poll’s choice, I think he’s the best player, and undoubtedly the best defensive player still on the board at the time of your pick. No complaints here!

i don’t think we need a 3 technique like Price anyway, I want a nose tackle type, I’m hoping the giants pick Dan Williams if it’s possible, that dude’s got a motor. Any thoughts?

Morgan is an extremely talented end and a top 10 talent. If this guy is still around, and our favorite pick here at BBV, Rolando, is gone we gotta snag him up. You don’t pass up all pro potential from the DE spot. Osi and Kiwi are not all pros at this point in time. Our ends actually weren’t impressive at all last year. And remember this is a mock based on who fell to 15. Rolo didn’t, Morgan did…Solid pick Ed.

No one knows what will happen with these guys when they get to camp. Its not like the Giants sent 3 DL to the Pro Bowl last year. They struggled pressuring the passer for entire games, so something wasn’t right. You have to approach next season as if last season is the new normal.

No other guy on the board that I like more. Probably equal to Earl Thomas (who I think has playmaker potential), but the choice between a S and DL of equal skill, you take the DL.

Morgan is the BPA at this point and I don’t think price is the kind of dt we need. I’d prefer Cody or cam thomas

JR looks at the current state of our defensive ends and doesn’t see Kiwi as ever making a move to the next step and sees Osi as either done, or unwilling to accept the role he’d be used in and sees Morgan as a potential All-Pro and 10-year fix to the problem. I think Morgan might have that capability.

but if I’m picking, I want more than a seven game career to go on. Pierrre-Paul certainly has potential, but he also could be a total bust. If it’s the second, it’s the kind of move that can doom a franchise. If it’s the first, you tip your hat to who takes him and congratulate Mayock on his observation. I’d still take Morgan 100 times out of 100 over Pierre-Paul with the Giants pick.

Look. This is a great example. What happens if all the best OT’s and the stud DT’s are gone and McClain is also off the board? The Giants were merely average rushing the passer and they were lacking in stopping the run. So, it comes down to who Jerry has ranked highest on his board of remaining players. Will he have Morgan or Price ranked higher? I think either guy would be a value pick and a need pick. There are still questions regarding Osi and Tuck. DT is a need but, you can never have too many pass rushers.

Sorry, I respectfully offer that this pick stinks.

If this is the scenario, and the Giants feel that a DE is the best available player on the board then the play is TRADE DOWN!!!!!!

If you are going to take a DE here, then answer these questions:

1) Why did the Giants draft Sintim?

2) Did the Giants dump OSI for an extra pick? If they did, then fine I will digress. But otherwise….

3) With three, potentially four effective DE’s on the roster (and I would also offer that Canty can be a servicable end), we are taking a “Developmental” player at that position that will play in a rotation when the Giants could take any number of players at probably no less than FOUR positions (ILB, OLB, DT, S) that could start and possibly play full time.

4) We have a complete CORE of a championship team, a franchise QB, a solid offense which we almost never have – and again, we are going to take someone at a position where we are absolutely the deepest – and leave several gaping holes on the defense unfilled? This is a guy who may very likely be rotational at BEST as a rookie…. Don’t get it.

No way. You will hear me booing clear from Houston if this is the pick WITHOUT making a move and aquiring additional picks for Osi, Kiwi or something to justify this pick. DUMP THIS PICK if this is what is going to happen, move down, and fill some of the gaping holes on this defense, not DE.

   I’m not sure they compartmentalize the budget quite that much with the various groupings of offensive and defensive positions, as I suspect they keep “the whole” of the team as the primary focus and will “find” money from another source to the extent it’s available to fill a hole elsewhere if they decide it needs filling. Totally agree on free agency (and trades) which will keep this a moving playing field until the actual draft day itself. For example if the Giants traded for a middle linebacker (don’t expect this), or signed one via free agency, what we’d be looking for in the draft would change greatly. The same for other teams, i.e. one of the early picks we project for a quarterback could change if Kolb ends up with one of those teams as an example. Then they’re no longer likely to overpay for ANOTHER quarterback in the draft.

     I don’t expect us to draft a safety early, but I do think availability of quality, along with medical information regarding Phillips that we don’t have, would play into that. Opperating as though Phillips isn’t available, if more than just words, could be justification for it, and if they feel the need, I don’t have a problem with it. Anyway, I generally agree that we’re speculating on an ever changing event with moving pieces and it’s probably best not to view anything as set in cement.

    I’d agree that there are patterns and general target areas, but that these are “goals” and subject to short-term fluctuation to deal with the individuals, situations and needs at hand. Also agree that the Rolle signing was MAJOR for flexibility in the draft as well as Phillips not being ready to go. I do expect we’ll add another safety, but not early or as a priority, but as hopefully quality depth. That would put us in reasonable shape throughout the secondary assuming Ross is healthy.

 I’ve watched this guy play and believe me he is an absolute freak of nature and,those who say that he’s not suited to play 4-3 don’t know what they’re talking about.Sure he was recruited to be a pass rushing LB at Michigan(Go Blue)but he proved to be more than just a pass rusher as he became a complete DE who can do both(stop the run and get to the QB).I’m not saying that Derrick Morgan is a bad choice but,I have a feeling that Brandon Graham will be the better pro.

I’ve been thinking this for a while and have said it on BBV a couple times. Osi was horrible against the run last year and I don’t think the Giants or many of the fans want to just give him the starting job no matter what. I believe the Giants made a mistake drafting Kiwi, and I don’t think he will reach his full potential until he leaves the Giants and becomes an OLB in a 3-4. The Giants do have a need at DE.

I have seen more than one draft report saying that this is the deepest draft at the DT position ever. There will be good DT’s available in the second and third round. It would be a mistake for the Giants to reach for one in the first round just because it is a greater need than DE. If I was Reese and Morgan was there at 15, if I knew I could get even a third -rounder for Osi I would pull the trigger.

I do disagree with you on McClain. I do not think he is a perfect fit at MLB in a 4-3. Even McClain has said he would be a better fit in a 3-4. The consensus on Weatherspoon seems to be that he is a better fit at WLB. They may be wonderful players, but if they don’t fit our needs or system, the Giants shouldn’t pick them.