New York Giants notes: What to make of McClain
by Ed Valentine on Mar 11, 2010 8:04 AM EST
in News
166 comments
So, Rolando McClain revealed at the Alabama Pro Day Wednesday that he has Crohn's Disease. Of course you do have to wonder if that will give teams like our New York Giants pause when it comes to April's NFL Draft.
By the way, want an indication that the Giants have a serious interest in the Alabama middle linebacker? How about the fact that GM Jerry Reese, head coach Tom Coughlin and linebackers coach Jim Herrmann were all in attendance Wednesday to watch McClain work. Hmmm.
Per NFL.com's Gil Brandt, by the way, McClain ran faster than originally reported. His 40 times were 4.68 and 4.69. Check out some video of McClain's Pro Day.
Want to check out reports on all the Pro Days. NFL.com is offering a 'Pro Days' blog.
- Kenny Phillips is continuing to spread the optimism when it comes to his recovery from micro-fracture surgery for an arthritic knee condition.
"I feel real good," Phillips said. "I’m making a lot of progress. The rehab is coming along real well. I should be running soon - - probably by the end of this month. As far as they tell me, it’s looking good. The knee is getting stronger."
The rehab, which Phillips has done mostly from his home in Miami, has been a very long process since he underwent surgery in September, mostly involving weights and strengthening exercises. He said he’s consulted with some athletes who suffered from the same condition (though he declined to name them) and "They reassured me that it’s something I can bounce back from as long as put in the work."
"Now I have no doubt at all," he said. "When it first occurred, I didn’t really know what it was myself. But after talking to trainers and doctors, I felt great about it. I already feel myself get stronger and getting back to the form that I had. I feel that I didn’t lose anything, to be honest with you."
Phillips will likely sit out the organized team activity (OTA) sessions in May and June and the mini-camp in mid-June, but he "definitely expects to be ready for the start of full-speed practices in late July. He’s so sure, in fact, that he occasionally pauses and pictures himself back on the field for the first time since mid-September.
"I kind of picture it all the time," Phillips said. "From the way my rehab is going I feel I’m definitely not going to lose anything. I can only get better. So I sometimes picture myself making interceptions, making tackles, just making the plays I used to. I just can’t wait."
Love KP's attitude. We just have to wait and see, though, if his knee will be able to take the daily grind of an NFL season. - ESPN's Matt Mosley had this to say on Wednesday regarding the Giants' draft plans.
It's hard to nail down a trend with Reese and his scouting staff because they're pretty patient about waiting for the right players. They rarely get obsessed with a certain position, although linebacker is certainly a big need in April. I expect the Giants to stay right where they are at No. 15 and select a talented player. But I promise you that Reese hasn't committed to taking a linebacker.
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Interesting
That JR, TC and Hermann would all show, is curious to me. On pro days involving first round picks, who would normally show to observe these players? Is it that unusual for TC and JR to attend with a position coach?
Phillips sure makes everything sound hopeful….my fingers are crossed.
My Mama and my teachers
use to always say there are no stupid questions…..then I started talking and they had to revise their collective opinion in stark realization that, sometimes, there is an exception to even the most inclusive rule.
Anyone know what Spikes ran?
Ed? FB?
I was under the impression McClain was more of a 4.5 40 guy, a real blazer. The more I see about Spikes, the more I am starting to like him (esp. with the probability McClain is gone at 15).
He ran 4.68
It was in the blurb about him above. Also, he said he is still not 100% from a hamstring injury he suffered during the season. So, if you believe that you would have to think he can be a little quicker than that.
by Ed Valentine on Mar 11, 2010 8:48 AM EST up reply actions
Spikes' 40
he didn’t run at the combine, but his pro-day is on March 17. He’ll most likely do the same thing McClain did and run at that one.
Opus smart , lascivio magis , intereo gauisus...
4-3 vs. 3-4 MLB
I’ve read that McClain is more a 3-4 ILB than a 4-3 MLB and that Reese would probably pass on him for that reason. Can someone let me know if that is the general consensus out there or that there really is no such distinction and this guy can perform in any system?
Well...
JR did not pass on Sintim who was a 3-4 OLB. I do believe that Goff and/or Kehl came from the 3-4 (I know one of them definitely did). So, JR’s track record suggests that McClain coming from a 3-4 does not matter. Not sold on McClain still. I want them to draft a MLB first round, but McClain and Spikes worry me. This may not be the draft for that. BPA looks like the best bet. If that is McClain, so be it. I just fear a Crohn’s flare up in the middle of the season.
These guys can play in any defensive system..
Alot of folks think these kids are locked into a 4-3 or 3-4..That just is not true at all..They are athletes..they get their playbooks, study them and adapt..Anyone who tells you different is nuts…That’s like somebody telling me I’m an F-4 pilot..Well I moved up to an F-16..then they tell me I’m an F-16 pilot..then I move into an F-117A pilot..So then they say I am an F-117A pilot..that is all a bunch of bullshit..These players can learn to play in any scheme a team wants to deploy.
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
Bama had a lot of 4-3 looks too
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 9:28 AM EST up reply actions
Sorry Bobbi, but you're comparing apples to....well.....rudder pedals
Once you get to the NFL, the body types needed for the positional responsibilities changes.
Let’s just say you’re looking for a WILL backer. You’re gonna look for a guy who’s the fastest LB available with fluid hips and an eye for the ball who is still big enough to be effective at the run. He is your main pass coverage LB.
MLB- Big and strong enough to shed blocks from 300lb behemoths, quick recognition skilss. fearless tackler doesn’t mind playing in traffic and has decent cover skills. Good lateral quickness comes in handy here.
SAM- usually your strongest linebacker, lines up across from the TE, making it the side the ball is run to, so quickly shedding blockers is the game. Also, the main TE coverage goes to the SAM, unless he crosses the middle, so you have to have some coverage skills.
If you look at Sintim’s physical build and compare him to Boley you see the ideal body types for their respective positions.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Good points...
…I was thinking like Bobbiblue the other day but had to check myself. Only the elite athletes have the ability to play multiple spots without sacrificing. Their physical and mental abilities are definately suited for one position more than others.
This site has the best football talk ever!!!
by Last year in Sec 127 on Mar 11, 2010 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
Just to illustrate the body types
Here are the measurables from both Sintim and Boley’s combine and McClain’s pro day:
Sintim………McClain………Boley
Height………..6’3"…………6’4"…………..6’3"
Weight……….256…………249…………..236
40…………….4.82…………4.69………….4.56
Vert…………..34.5"…………35"……………34"
Brd Jmp……..9’11"…………9’1"…………..9’5"
3-cone……….7.37………….7.91………….7.08
Now, there’s alot of things you can draw from these numbers.
The 3-cone shows that, on paper, the physical ability for coverage favors Boley, then Sintim and McClain, which makes sense as to position responsibilities.
The body sizes in order of position seem to match as well with Sintim being the largest with McClain and Boley following.
I think this just illustrates the specialization of the positions and their corresponding body types when referring to my previous post. Keep in mind that there are many players in the NFL that, for reasons of athletic ability, don’t necessarily match the body type, but you would see the performance numbers to be similar for the respective position.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
McClain had a 7.19 3-cone…which is pretty good for an injured dude
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
…might have to scroll down a bit on the “pro day” one
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
Hmm that is interesting
from the 2nd video on http://blog.al.com/tide-source/2010/03/tides_mcclain_discloses_that_h.html when he is getting interviewed it sounds like he is saying “259”
by mclaren_is_the_best on Mar 11, 2010 1:20 PM EST up reply actions
so now
he doesn’t know he had a hamstring injury during the combine and didn’t know his correct weight during his pro day…..
by mclaren_is_the_best on Mar 11, 2010 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
Didn't hear any of that.....
sounded like he said “his teammates didn’t really know about it”.
and he wants to run his 40 in the “Four fifty nine range”..(4.59)
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 2:05 PM EST up reply actions
he said that too
threw out a bunch of numbers.
But not that he weighed 259
and also he said he knew about the hammy, since the “Tennessee game”
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 2:22 PM EST up reply actions
No I meant that during the combine he told Charles Davis at first that he didn’t want to do the drills just because. later his agent called and told them that he had a tweeked hamstring
Anyway I like that he is at ~250 which IMO is the perfect weight for a MLB, its not too thin to have blockers eat him up and its not too heavy that he won’t be able to keep up with the tight ends
by mclaren_is_the_best on Mar 11, 2010 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
It is interesting
that he has shed a few pounds.
by Ed Valentine on Mar 12, 2010 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
Sun...you put together some nice analysis and stats here but..
They barely differ from one to the other in size or speed..weight maybe, but that is something that can be added if need be..You make very good points regarding the various positional roles LBs play, but they all can learn to play those roles through study and training..There is not a single candidate out there that is going to walk into the Giants camp and play linebacker in any role..There are rarely Lawrence Taylors in this league..what role did he fill?..Everything and anything..His qualities were size, speed, tenacity and the fact that his elevator never reached the top floor from a smarts perspective.
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
I’ve heard “Pepper Johnson” as the name with McClain.
…how’s about we go head and draft/sign a porker to play NT (given Terrence Cody ‘slimming down’ to 349…maybe he’s our NT should he fall to #46?)
Lets get McClain and roll with the 3-4 (and some hybrid stuff of course…)! Where’s G fan since 57 when you need em?
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 2:24 PM EST up reply actions
agree, it was in jest.
Tho the writing may be on the wall.
Get the gut of Bama’s D….lets eat QB.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
I've been saying all along how we could use another NT type
Makes it alot easier on the rest of the front when 2 OL are engulfed and moving backwards into the pocket.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
either or...
if they get a large fat, they could use some 3-4 looks…couldn’t hurt.
Maybe not Cody…maybe Linval Joseph? 6"5 325 with 39 reps with 34 inch arms…is no joke, dude has strength up the cornhole.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
Tho with Pep…I think he could be a 4-3 Mike backer.
If your smart enough to be in the right spot…your lack of athleticism isn’t gonna hurt you.
And lets face it…Rolando McClain is not a slow man…he’s a hell of an athlete.
If he’s a braniac on the field…AND an athlete…AND 6"3 249lbs…fk it, throw his ass out there and let him make plays.
He’s only a junior too, unlike most of these others. He’s not nearly as finished a product as the others.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 2:26 PM EST up reply actions
Mcclain is at the level to be able to come in and compete for a starting spot
from the get go. Whether or not TC believes that will play alot into who they draft. At #15 they want immediate returns from anybody other than a QB, at least that’s my take on it from what I’ve seen over the years.
Those numbers can be talen alot of ways, but subtle differences in build can be pretty telling. 20 lbs can be a big difference on an athlete of similar height.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Not sure Cody has any chance to be a Giant draft pick prior to round 3
He is a high risk high reward any earlier than 3rd round. And this year the middle of the 3rd round could have Reshad Jones sitting there.
Reese will take a risk, but not in round 1 or 2. When he grabbed Manningham there was no one near as talented on the board. Cody is the same kind of player. If he is serious he could be great, but he could easily go Man v Food after his signing bonus.
I have no idea how that Man v Food dude is even alive.
His blow pressure has to break the meter and his cholesterol is through the roof.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 3:52 PM EST up reply actions
He's pretty much locked in to being a 3-4 NT
Dan Williams may be the only NT type that’s athletic enough to mix it up on our D-Line. Cam Thomas looked pretty damn good in the Senior Bowl, though.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Man would I love his job tho.
But how is he not like 300 lbs by now?
"I'm not a scratch golfer. I don't know how to bowl. I can't read the stock market. Hell, I have a hard time rememberingmy wife's cell phone number. But I can call 'Flip right double X jet 36 counter naked waggle at 7 X quarter' in my sleep" - Gruden
by I_Formation27 on Mar 11, 2010 5:01 PM EST up reply actions
McClain
I’ve also heard during the scouting combine that he didnt wan’t 2 play in a 4-3 only a 3-4, I don’t know if this is true but I would be DISAPPOINTED because this guy could have a Pat Willis type impact at the MLB spot for the Nxt. couple of years!
Pat willis plays in a 34
so Mcclain could and will still have an impact regardless, just like pat would have the same impact in a 43 aswell
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
him saying it doesn’t matter.
A team isn’t gonna pass over a player just cuz they don’t want to play in a system.
If the Giants feel he’s a bad fit, then yea..they’ll pass.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 9:53 AM EST up reply actions
Yea who cares what he says
Its a job, if they PAY you PLAY and thats it, but he’s not gonna make it past Denver so he doesnt have to worry
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
I want a player who wants to play for me
I’m sorry the I pay you so you do what I say doesn’t always pan out. Will they play to get their money? Yeah probably. Would a player that wants to play for you give you a better effort and probably be a better player for you? Yup!
I agree
but rookies especially at LB typically just play and excel where you tell them too, not where they want to, now a guy whos 4-6 yrs in and is a FA is not gonna readily have you play him where u want him to, he’s more likely to put up a fight.
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
I agree!
If we was 2 draft McClain and he doesn’t want 2 play for us because we run a 4-3 then let his UNGRATEFUL self stay where he’s at. He know he’s good so he feels like the team that will draft him owns him something. Don’t get me wrong he probably is the best MLB but we don’t need CANCERS in our locker room!
Wow, how'd you get from
Folks saying he is a better fit in a 3-4 to him being an instant malcontent? Talk about jumping off a bridge!
Bleeding Blue since 1962
plus he’s always..ALWAYS on the field for Bama when they are on 3rd down sets.
ITs not like he’s never been in a 4-3 set, or even a nickel 4-2-5 set.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
McClain isn't a malcontent
I’ve heard he can be a bit tough to get along with, but Larry Bird was supposed to be the nastiest son of a gun in the NBA. On his team or against it (of course nastier to foes).
I think that McClain is just driven and expects teammates to be driven too.
If someone asked him what he preferred and he answered honestly, is that a flaw??
by giantblue63 on Mar 11, 2010 12:42 PM EST up reply actions
My understanding of Rolo is that he is the most popular and friendly
kid at the school. Everyone gravitates to the guy. Always smiling, engaging personality. He is demanding of his teammates and won’t tolerate slackers, but they all love him.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
The guy played in a 3-4 base defense, what’s he gonna say?
I’ve heard Sean Weatherspoon say he’d like to be a Will backer, that he idolizes Lance Briggs (good idol too…he’s a hell of a player).
..so while it seems there’s been a Weatherspoon bandwagon lately..are we gonna not draft Weatherspoon cuz he wants to be a WLB?
Give me a friggin break, the Giants and the evaluators..if they want either of these 2..will get one.
I’d put money that either would be playing the MLB spot too, as we’ve got a SLB and WLB already (unless they move Boley or Sintim to MLB…and I doubt that)
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
People need to remember that one of the first things NFL does
After draft is send kids to media training/life training
No way Mc or Spoon thought that their comments would be judged negatively.
When was the last time a LB sat out because he didn’t get to play 3-4 or 4-3
Never
by giantblue63 on Mar 11, 2010 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
I think he will make it past denver
They already spent a first rounder on DJ Williams a few years ago and have much bigger problems on offense and DLine to be going MLB.
by mclaren_is_the_best on Mar 11, 2010 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
I read the interview with Phillips..
And I was instantly optimistic about his comeback..He sounds extremely confident..and I love the fact that Rolle his heading to Miami to workout with him..That is outstanding news..what a tandem these two guys will be, having played together before..and beginning to work out together..these two guys are going to be awesome for us.
..Now Mcclain, I am not very concerned with his Crohns disease..that can be treated with AloeElite..I think he is a very good athlete..I also like Spikes..but my big concern is defensive tackle..
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
KP
We have talked about this before. Yes, reason to be optimistic. But, he is still only walking. Let’s see how the knee reacts when he starts to run. And, how it holds up to going every single day in training camp.
by Ed Valentine on Mar 11, 2010 9:11 AM EST up reply actions
Crohn's Disease
I don’t know about using AloeElite on it, but after reading this…http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crohn’s_disease
I am not sure what symptoms he has and how severe it may be. From what Wiki says, it can be just about anything listed on there. Of course, team doctors are at least put on notice with his condition and team staffs will have something else to talk about. Hope this makes him drop to 15 :) here’s to wishful thinking!
Opus smart , lascivio magis , intereo gauisus...
Just have to be careful..
I know from my own experience (diverticulitis), the names sound worse than the actual
“illness”, adjust your diet. In my case, have to keep away from foods with seeds, yeah I miss
popcorn and corn on the cob.
by Great Gatsby on Mar 11, 2010 10:09 AM EST up reply actions
Im in the same boat
Got really sick and went to the hospital in college. After that I had to change my life, but its been for the better. I just made a mental decision to eliminate stress from my life, changed my diet and made sure I was rested. Did pretty well in college sports after that. There are a lot of athletes who have it. Also a lot of people who have it and dont even know. It is a strike against him because he will be a little more prone to dehydration and may miss a few practices, but I always found my body waited until after competition to get sick.
One of the treatments for Crohn's ...
is mild steroids. Something tells me that option is not there in the NFL (or they’d all complain of cramps …), but probably not in college either.
Just hope we do our homework on this one. I remember Rolf Benirschke (SD kicker awhile back) had this, had emergency surgery and almost died. Might have been a more severe case, and ulcerative colitis, etc. Do your homework JR.
On the other hand, something like this could increase chances he’s there at # 15.
Crohn's Disease.
It’s treatable! It shouldn’t affect his effectiveness on the field. We’ll see where Jerry Reese goes at 15.
The Giants have had a good offseason to this point. Why you may ask? We’ll the other big three in the NFC East have none done close to nothing to this point.
by ChicagoGiantsFan on Mar 11, 2010 9:21 AM EST reply actions
Ah, the worse case scenario is he'd be on the field and shit his pants..
And your right..I wrote an earlier post..as far as FA is concerned..
The Cowboys have done nothing
The Redskins cleaned house – major re-build
The Eagles have also cleaned house – to a lesser degree
We fixed our secondary and are working on other areas of concern
The division is ours if the players stay healthy..
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
Cowboys also won the division
at 11-5, so doing nothing might be to their benefit.
Yes they did..but..
They have o-line issues and secondary issues to address..the rest of their team looks pretty solid..
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
Cowboys
were in the final 8 teams, so i think they have to lose someone before they can get someone from FA
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
I think...
That was a stupid rule the NFL instituted, hell you can go from 6-10 to making it to the Super Bowl the next year. I don’t see how this helps parity (NFL loves that word).
by Great Gatsby on Mar 11, 2010 10:29 AM EST up reply actions
it was to prevent a good team from scooping up free agents in the uncapped year
by giantblue63 on Mar 11, 2010 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
Still
Stupid to me..eventually there will be an agreement.
by Great Gatsby on Mar 11, 2010 10:32 AM EST up reply actions
Anything that messes with the Cowboys is OK with me
Only thing better would be if he signed another expensive bum like Roy Williams
by giantblue63 on Mar 11, 2010 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
It actually was to protect the smaller market teams in case of an uncapped year
So the JJ’s and the Snyder’s of the league couldn’t just spend their way to the next level if they already made the top 8.
Luckily Snyder’s showing restraint and JJ’s hands are tied.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Im not worried
about the Crohns thing, I know a couple people with it, u just really have to manage your diet thats all, Mcclain looked good but im still not so sure what puts him so far above spikes, if Mcclain is there at 15, I would take him but spikes and weatherspoon are right there with him to me, he is probably just slightly more ready from an intelligence standpoint but by game 10, they should all be up to speed in whatever system the get drafted to. as for the 43/34 thing, cmon lets be serious him and spikes can and will make an impact in either system. I didnt see JR or Jim, every shot i saw was TC looking closely at Mcclain, im sure they were all there tho and they will probably all be at spikes and weatherspoons as well. I caution people tho JR is the king of misdirection, just because hes there doesnt conclude anything and just because he doesnt go to certain places means nothing either.
No one from the Giants ever brought KP in or called him or interviewed him or went to his pro day. they just drafted him based on his tape so theres no telling what JR will do.
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
Teams don't visit pro days for a smokescreens.
Thay call kids in for visits to accomplish that.
Not every LB is capable of playing every spot. Spikes could not play WILL if his life depended on it. McClain is that rare combination of football intellect, experience running a pro-style defense and physical attributes that are off the chart.
Heres the NFL networks take on him. Pay attention to the short clips of him running drills and keep in mind that this is a guy with a hamstring injury and inflamed bowels doing better than almost any LB at the combine:
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-draft/09000d5d816df8a7/Alabama-pro-day-report
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Spikes cant play wil???
Why do you assume the will and sam positions are the same in every 43, that is so far from the truth, the wil position on the eagles is different from the wil position on the vikes so first you have to determin the scheme……………. another thing is Danny clarke was originially brought in to play wil on the Giants so i think spikes could handle wil in alotta schemes lol trust me……….another thing is sam and wil are interchangeable in our system and fewell’s systems so your wrong about that.
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
In either spot he’d need to be able to cover TEs and FBs which I don’t know if he can do at an NFL level.
WILL and SAM are interchangeable in our defense?
You can’t expect that comment to be taken seriously.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
So your sayin there not??? lol be careful
I dont think you know what your talking about in the Gmen scheme the last 3 yrs sam and wil have been interchangeable…….if the TE goes in motion the responsibility shifts, i hope you are aware of that
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
That doesn't make them interchangeable. Shifts are designed to get a favorable match up.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
according to TC, Spags, Herman and JR
Sam and Wil are interchangeable in our D just like free and strong. so i think i will take their word for it
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
You know you can't make a comment like that without sources
if you want ANY credibility at all.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Apparently, you shouldn't be saying anything about anybody not knowing what
their talking about. Look up top to what I posted for Bobbiblue and then spend some time researching defenses and linebackers and schemes. Also look up the difference between “their”, “there” and “they’re”, I know I’m picking nits, but it’s a pet peeve of mine, and most other literary types.
The Strong side LB(SAM) is just that. He lines up accross from the TE. Show me where this isn’t the way the Giants play it.
The rest is kind of self expalanatory. Now, you could be confusing the fact that our Safeties are interchangeable, as is pretty much becoming the norm in the league.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
But he will have inflamed bowels every day for the rest of his life
More or less, so that’s part of the deal
by giantblue63 on Mar 11, 2010 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
But Danny clarke could??
You can also scheme it to where your LB’s are limited in coverage………..thats why we got rolle and KP, they will get the bulk of the TE work, as for FB’s, cmon are you saying that spikes cant cover 99% of the fullbacks in the NFL?? seriously??
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
danny clarke struggled
against te’s.. and the only reason he did a below avg job and not a horrendous job is b/c of his experiance and smarts.
it would be too much to ask for spikes to jump in and play the will
why would spikes be playing wil for the giants???
we have Boley!!! i was just using clarke as an example
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
I think Spoon is above spikes...
The kid is a true athlete at 240lbs. He came out of school with 400 plus tackles. Played every position at LB and has great instincts. To me, thats a baller and is a better prospect than McClain.
Spoon was more productive
than any defensive player besides suh to me and i would jump on him @#15
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
Yes he is
I agree with that, but i think spikes is a gem tho, but spoon is better tho
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
Rolando,Weatherspoon,Trade back if possible or Trent Williams!
In that order exactly thats what Jerry Reese’s mind should be thinking.
I DONT WANT TO HEAR ABOUT BRANDON SPIKES! I WOULD CRY IF I HEAR HIS NAME CALLED!! IM NOT SURE IF I WANT HIM AT 46 LET ALONE AT 15!!!
I really like Weatherspoon, he seems like a natural born leader, hes EXTREMELY FAST AND EXTREMELY STRONG 4.5 AND 35 REPS! I think he’ll come in with a chip on his shoulder because he comes from a less known and he seems like a guy thats dying to make a name for himself.
He Killed It!
He ran a 4.5 and had 35 reps, 3 MORE THEN NDAMUKONG SUH! he would be top three reps if he was a OLineman or DLineman!
but he's got 31 inch arms....
easier to complete a bench rep with that.
He’s strong…yes. But that’s not comparable to Suh’s bench numbers.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 10:45 AM EST up reply actions
Understand
your right. I still think its nasty, I still want Rolando McClain first regardless but other then him Weatherspoon is a good option…Also I hear the Giants really like CJ Spiller, they’re all over him at his pro day today..I think the Giants want to have a bi play guy like the Cowboys have in Felix Jones and the Eagles have Desean Jackson
meh..
i like bench..but squats need/should be looked at more importantly than the bench
most of all power in football comes from the strength in legs and hip motion
exactly
its all about playing with leverage
by mclaren_is_the_best on Mar 11, 2010 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
thats why linebackers go in that crazy stance before the ball is snapped.
by mclaren_is_the_best on Mar 11, 2010 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
There's a big difference in application, here
I think the squat would be a great measurable on a linemen, but not as useful on a linebacker. As you move from the trenches, the quick twitch muscles become more of the emphasis.
I would like to see squats with the Linemen added to the combine/pro days, but I’d have to defer to the experts that run the league.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
??
bench is almost one of the least important weightlifting techniques in football. there are
yes, being strong in teh chest is vital. You have to get off blocks and shove ppl out of the way.. but the bench itself. the exact range of motion is not one that is likely to be repeated on the field..
shedding blocks comes from hand technique, and leg strength.
if anything. bench is only really important when looking at lineman.
Whether We Take Weatherspoon or McClain
I hate to say this but I think we need to look at both of their characters. The one who has the worst character will be the best player. I.E Lawrence Taylor, Ray Lewis, etc… Temperment is real important for impact positions such as MLB.
by ChicagoGiantsFan on Mar 11, 2010 10:54 AM EST reply actions
I hate to open up a can of worms on this one but lets look at the great NFL players of the last 30 years and see how many of them had run-ins with law enforcement. I’m sure we all could name at least a dozen or so. My point is that temperment plays a huge role in effectiveness in positions such as MLB.
by ChicagoGiantsFan on Mar 11, 2010 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
A few off the top of my head
Bill Romanowski, Lawrence Taylor and Ray Lewis
by ChicagoGiantsFan on Mar 11, 2010 11:09 AM EST up reply actions
It does
But u can have an aggressive temperment on the field without run ins with the law maaaaan. Are you insane lol
But dont tell em i told you that !!!!!
Well...
I guess I’m being a little bit selfish but I’d love to see the Giants draft someone who had the same attributes as LT. I’d love to find someone like that without the baggage but I don’t think that is possible.
by ChicagoGiantsFan on Mar 11, 2010 11:14 AM EST up reply actions
Furthermore
When you are assembling a team you need to think about the type of players you want to have at specific positions. If I was a GM this is the blueprint I would use.
QB Passive, Wonderlic over 30
HB Neutral
FB Aggressive
WR 3 Neutral, 1 Aggressive
TE 1 Neutral, 1 Aggressive
T Aggressive
G Neutral
C Neutral
DE Aggressive
DT Aggressive
LB (Depending on scheme) MLB Aggressive OLB Neutral
CB Neutral
S Aggressive
K/P Passive
by ChicagoGiantsFan on Mar 11, 2010 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
I used to drive Teddy Bruschi when he was at Arizona.
The quietest, most respectful kid you could ever meet. Get his helmet on and he wants to “kill your mama”.
You’ve written alot of words, but none of them prove your point.
Simply put, you are talking about character as if you don’t really know what that word means.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Ray Nitschke
Ray Nitschke was a lot like Bruschi as well. I’ll agree with you that not every good LB has had run ins with the law but there have been a few.
You have to agree with me that there is a certain personality trait that makes players like Bruschi, Nitschke and Taylor excel at their position. Not everyone has it…
My argument was about players having an aggresive temperment. Some players are able to control it and some can not.
I do understand where you are coming from.
by ChicagoGiantsFan on Mar 11, 2010 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
I get that you're talking more about temperament than character
There are alot of players that turn it on when they get on the field.
Believe it or not, Ray Lewis is a soft spoken guy off the field.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Warren Sapp too
been in trouble with the LAW and was a great player
by mclaren_is_the_best on Mar 11, 2010 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
That's a coincidence, though, not a causal relationship.
Now, if you were saying that Warren Sapp being the total asshole that he is makies the law issue relative, then you have a causal relationship.
That is one big, major a-hole. I’ve met him on several occasions and he’s a total dick.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
McClain or Weatherspoon
McClain I hear is temperamental, I hear he doesnt get along with everyone but thats just rumors. Weatherspoon is an exciting player with alot of energy and speed. I think you cant go wrong with either when it comes to temperment……The Giants were all over Rolando at his pro day, I watched the videos and you could see the LB coach all over all the drills and when he went down with his stomach issue Jim went over and shook his hand with a few others
Is it just me...
or do most folks here feel fairly confident with our current LB core? I surely don’t, but McClain would be a nice addition and a game changer if he’s available. Smart football guy, Crohn’s disease or not.
We didn't even have a chance for the "perfect season", but we did have the perfect ending.
Boley’s a solid WLB. Sintim as much of a prospect as anyone we add at SLB too.
…I dunno that we need to wipe the slate clean here, maybe hire some friggin trainers or send em to some classes to figure out how to treat a hamstring pull.
Could stand to add one or 2 LB’s. I’d like them to get competition for Goff at least. And if they get a middle round SAM backer (or better yet, get Jamar Chaney in the 2nd/3rd) it would help depth.
I dunno how anyone could be confident in the whole team…only thing they can do is feel that with health, they’ll be more 2007-2008 then 2009.
No amount of rookies is gonna take the Giants back to the promised land. It will help of course.
Injury luck is what’s gonna help them. Kehl and Goff are talented 3rd year players. Wilkinson is a very talented player that can’t stay on the field. Not saying rely on them….but if probably close to as reliable as a rook.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
I've read on the Twitternet that the Giants are spending a good deal of time with
CJ Spiller.
BWHAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!!
Master of the squeegee
Because they believe in BPA
and he is too good to ignore
by giantblue63 on Mar 11, 2010 12:53 PM EST up reply actions
Now that is a good thing!!!..YESSSS!!
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
Keep in mind, that there are other players to look at.
The Giants cover everybody they can, but sending your GM, Head Coach AND position coach to a school with 10 other notable pro days on the same date is pretty telling.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Must be proof that daylight savings time is coming..
Everybody is mighty ‘testy’ here today !!..lol..I’ll let the experts pick who they want to draft to fill holes..The rest of us just need to remember to move our clocks forward 1 hour before we sack out Saturday night.
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
bunch a bastadges.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 2:34 PM EST up reply actions
CROHNS
i have crohns disease. if he manages it properly, he can play without any issues.
As foreign as it may sound to some, it's actually not very uncommon.
We probably all know someone with Crohn’s and don’t know it.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Yeah I don't even know why they call it a 'disease'..That term scares people..It is treatable...and when
treated it is controllable..I get a big charge out of these infocommercials..they tout these drugs for this and that and then proceed to follow with the 8000 side effects they can cause..I just laugh at that shit..might as well swallow a gun..hmmm my ass itches..well just purchase our anti-ass itch cream..but your dick may fall off..where’s the gun?
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
LOL!!!..yep
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
I am going to stick with my analogy that I offered up here somewhere..
When I think of football players..and I have watched for 49 years and played the game when I was younger..Now like I said, there are basically three levels of defense..the D-line, the Linebacking and the Secondary..Now these three levels require certain size,speed and skill requirements in each category..but they can learn to work in any system a team decides to deploy..there is no such thing as a strictly 3-4 player or a 4-3 player..that is pure bullshit..When the Airforce moved me from an F-4 to an F-16 I had the skills but needed to study..same thing when I moved to an F-117A..I had to study..I had the skillset, I just needed to study and learn..same thing with anything you do and football is no different…You learn to adapt..If anybody tries to infer anything different they are full of shit..and Freebradshaw..if CJ Spiller is someone we could trade up for I would do it in a heartbeat..I don’t believe in trading up but he would be an exception..That kid is going to be a good one and I’d love for him to be in a Giants uniform.
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
The reason I responded to your post before, Bobbi, was the analogy
A fighter pilot is a fighter pilot. When you first started, they trained you on props, you got your IFR and then went into a trainer and got jets. I liken that to the pro level in Football.
Being trained on different platforms doesn’t resquire a different skillset, just different techniques and the capacity to learn. They determined your skillset and aptitude way before they put you in an expensive fighter aircraft.
What we are referring to is raw skillsets that are determined mostly by nature. That is where the confusion and separation lies.
To illustrate it along with your analogy, the guys who could fly but washed out as a fighter pilot could still fly transport or any other wing in the squadron. Are you getting my drift?
Bleeding Blue since 1962
Well..
That is true..those that didn’t get assigned to a fighter..were what we fondly referred to as Greyhound bus drivers..but they were also equally important..when I scooted up out of Baghdad 50 times that bus driver needed to be there for me to get some gas..So using a military analogy when talking football is relevant..think about football terminology and then think about military terminology..It is so closely related in terms and phrases that I laugh about it sometimes..I guess Football had alot of influence on what I wound up doing for 24 years.
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
Well, Pat Traina at Inside Football
is convinced that we will be moving up in the draft to select a LB according to the smokescreens she has already seen in place.
There’s not a single reporter with more credibility than this lady. The low profile of her publication also trends away from the sensationalism of the other rags. With the relationships she has built over the years in the Giants organization, her sources are immaculate.
This could get exciting.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
I hope she’s wrong.
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 6:07 PM EST up reply actions
Me too..I want Spiller
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
She needs to go bar-hopping with Big Ben
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
they can invite Pac Man Jones and some $1 bills.
Make it RAIIIIIN!!
Master of the squeegee
by FreeBradshaw on Mar 11, 2010 6:16 PM EST up reply actions
He just read the full thread above about "interchangeable" ...
without eating a single Twinkie. The pounds just kind of sloughed off.
I just watched a lot of film
on Mcclain and i wasnt too impressed, he made good tackles but his ability to realy fly to the ball left something to be desired, Witherspoon seemed to fly to the ball more but missed a few more tackles than Mcclain
Who's the newbie?..
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
All this crap about McClain and SLB = WLB dribble...
and I didn’t notice the Kenny Phillips thing.
…the friggin confidence this dude exudes about his recovery is miraculous. I mean….does he really have to say all this? I don’t think so, it seems genuine to me.
For real…maybe KP does come back better then ever? Can Spags e-mail Fewell those plans of those aborted “search and sack” missions he never sent KP on?
Its almost to the point..that if they didn’t draft a safety at all and let Rouse, CC..(yea, CC), Rashaad….whoever else, UDFA’s and Mike Johnson all compete for the reserve spots.
Its all about tha U!!!
Master of the squeegee
Amen brother..
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
..."search and sack" is bordeline pause-worthy
"I'm not a scratch golfer. I don't know how to bowl. I can't read the stock market. Hell, I have a hard time rememberingmy wife's cell phone number. But I can call 'Flip right double X jet 36 counter naked waggle at 7 X quarter' in my sleep" - Gruden
by I_Formation27 on Mar 12, 2010 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
Merlin Olsen died..69..I was going to leave a comment..
But there was already 863 of them..Alot of them were not so nice..How can you not love that guy?..Sometimes I wonder about people..It makes no sense to me..Doing what I had to do I sometimes wonder also..what will people think?..Will they know?..That I’d give the shirt off my back for anybody?..That was Merlin Olsen..same kinda guy..What a great guy he was..Fearsome foursome on the field and a generous man off of it..I was asked by a reporter once..she is pretty famous, about surgical strikes aimed at limiting collateral damage ..Well I gave her this..If there is a Chrysler parked in the middle of a Ford lot, I could shoot a bomb into its glove compartment..Well, she was impressed..the problem is the fucking bomb weighed 3,250 pounds..alot of Fords would get taken out..She never picked up on that fact…I’ll give you a hint her first name is Paula and her sidekick’s first name was Harry..I don’t really know for sure why I mention this, other than I wonder what people think sometimes…Merlin Olsen was a great football player on the football field and a very generous man off of it…The only thing about that interview for me was learning that the Giants beat Buffalo in the super bowl..when I finally flew home I could tell my wife didn’t want me doing that anymore, but I continued on for a few more years because of 9/11..then retired (plus I was back in my sports car the F16)..Anyway, I think about this stuff alot and I hope you all know that these men and women over there are in constant danger..so we can enjoy shit like football or baseball or hockey, etc,,When I read snide remarks about a guy like Merlin Olsen..it pisses me off.
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
A salute to you Bobbi...
and all like you….your sincerity and depth of feeling are just two of the reasons I always look for your posts….
Arguements
I read these posts everyday and have yet to comment, but after watching this prolonged disaggrement continue for as long as it has i felt the need to respond, there are reasons to disaggree i admit, but to take it this far is rediculous, its almost as if its too the point that one person or the other wants to impose their intellect over the other, i thought the point of these posts is for new, knowledge and discussion concerning our team and potential prospects???? ………….. if not then i’m not at the right place!
Yeah there are definitely a few that tend to "impose their 'intellect'"
But you shouldn’t let it discourage you from visiting BBV. Aside from those rare exchanges, there are far more intelligent and respectful debates on this site. Far better than any other Giants blog that I know of. Keep faith!
"I'm not a scratch golfer. I don't know how to bowl. I can't read the stock market. Hell, I have a hard time rememberingmy wife's cell phone number. But I can call 'Flip right double X jet 36 counter naked waggle at 7 X quarter' in my sleep" - Gruden
by I_Formation27 on Mar 12, 2010 10:47 AM EST up reply actions
eddie..It is all in good fun..some guys are more opinionated then others, including me are..
But it is alot of fun..usually when a fire starts to smolder I just attempt to joke around..Frankly I don’t have enough time to study every free agent and draft pick, and I’m not interested to impose my intellect on anybody..but I do enjoy everyones comments and bantor..I especially enjoy toying around with the trolls when they show up..To me that is funnier than hell..There are alot of guys here that really have some good commentary, and we’d at least I would, like to have you share your views..The bottom-line is there is not one single person out here that has a vote on who we pick..The giants don’t project this website on a screen in their meeting room..but it is nice to hear what other fans are thinking..and once in awhile a good ‘pissing contest’ occurs, which I just find hilarious..there have been some comments made here weeks ago that when I think about them still have me in hysterics..So join the club and be an expert analyst with the rest of us..lol
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
eddie1
Just to clear the air Bobbiblue, i was not commenting but you, that said, i agree with what you say and also about a good “pissing contest” lol …………… i just feel that sometimes it goes to far but ……….. i will continue to come here and, as for the expert analyst part, i will leave that to you guys, lmao ………… however, i will interject a comment on occassion, thanks again.
We get caught up sometimes, but don't worry
We’re mostly pretty respectful of eachother. Sorry if you found the “tirade” unappealing. The passion tends to run deep and some of us take this pretty seriously.
Bleeding Blue since 1962
eddie1
“commenting but you” ……….. should be ……. commenting about you, lol
Lol!!..yeah I knew what you meant eddie..thanks
"When I was a boy and had no sense I got my pecker stuck in an electric fence..Well it curled my hair and tickled my balls, and made me shit in my overalls"
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