Can the Giants be Super again?
by Ed Valentine on Feb 7, 2010 7:00 AM EST
in News
48 comments
Around 10 p.m. EST fans of either the New Orleans Saints or Indianapolis Colts will be in a complete state of euphoria. Their team will have just won Super Bowl XLIV to become champion of the sport.
There is, of course, no better feeling for a sports fan than the complete euphoria of the moment your team is crowned champion of a sport. It is, of course, a feeling we know as Giants fans. The fact that we know it recently -- recently enough that the sweet taste of ultimate victory still lingers for us -- makes watching the Saints battle the Colts for the title of champion tough to swallow.
We want to know. Why isn't it our Giants facing the Colts? After 2007 things looked like they were all set up for a possibly dynastic run by the Giants. Alas, a self-inflicted shooting, a key coaching defection later we are left to wonder what happened. Also, how long will we have to wait for a chance to feel that euphoria again?
Yes, I'm sure we will see plenty of shots of Eli Manning today. But, he won't be in uniform on the field trying to shoot down Peyton in the Manning Bowl we have all wanted for so long. He will be in a skybox, probably in a suit that doesn't look quite right on him. He will be pumping his fist and cheering for Peyton when things go well for Indianapolis. He will likely flash that Eli face, the grimace we all hate to see, when things go awry for the Colts.
Question is, how long will we have to wait for our chance to feel that euphoria again? Will it come while Eli is still the Giants quarterback? Will it come next year? Can it come in 2010, despite a tremendously disappointing 2009 season?
This is the NFL. Of course our turn could come again in 2010. Why not? Yes, by current New York Giants standards 2009 was a bad season. But, the Giants are not a bad football team devoid of reasons to be anything but optimistic.
In Manning, the Giants have the first essential ingredient in winning another championship. A championship-caliber quarterback. They have a championship-caliber organization, including a coach, general manager and scouting department that know what they are doing.
They have gobs of talent on offense, even if some of that talent did not play up to its ability level in 2009.Better health in 2010 and you may see the most prolific offense in Giants history.
The defense needs help, but there is reason to feel good. There is a new coordinator, an experienced one who has shown he knows what he is doing and has a reputation for getting the most out of players. There are some talented defensive players with wounded pride, who are sure to enter 2010 wanting to erase the taste of consistently being run over in 2009.
Championships are not easy to win. When you get one, it doesn't necessarily mean another will follow. We know that in our heads, but in our hearts we bleed for that feeling of euphoria, we want it each and every season.
I have faith that the feeling will come again, and that it will come during Eli Manning's tenure as Giants quarterback.
(E-mail Ed at bigblueview@gmail.com)
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Flip the baseball card over
In baseball it’s assumed that a player will get the usual numbers that he has put up in the past. If we were to flip the proverbial card of the 2009 Giants over, we’d see that many players woefully underperformed. Some players had an opportunity to step up and didn’t take advantage of it.
Diehl can no longer play LT at a high level. Seubert and McKenzie probably can’t play a full season without getting injured. After two bad years in a row, Pierce cannot be the starting MLB. Kehl has yet to distinguish himself on defense. We have no sure thing in the safeties. Webster has to regain his consistency. Ross has to get on the field, even if as a safety. Nobody wants to resign Clark but Sintim has yet to prove himself. Canty needs to earn his contract. Boss needs to improve his route-running. Manningham needs to improve his consistency. Osi needs to maintain gap containment on running plays.
Before I say that the Giants can be Super Bowl-worthy again, I need to see how the draft and free agency go. Also, I need to see players bounce back – either in their health, their performance, or both. In the words of John Mara, the status quo did not work this year.
Lots of questions, of course
All teams have questions, though. My major point is really that the glass is hardly empty.
I agree for the most part
But what’s wrong with Boss?
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
Boss
The only issue I have ever heard with Boss being a primary weapon is something Kevin Gilbride said during the season. He said they want to throw to him more, but that Boss sometimes has trouble getting off the line of scrimmage, thus he can get bumped off his route at times. My thought is he is still young and still learning.
by Ed Valentine on Feb 7, 2010 10:06 AM EST up reply actions
I've watched the tape
Boss needs to get off the line faster and run better routes. He can’t get separated from defenders quickly enough. Eli can’t wait for him so he goes to other people. A player shows you that he doesn’t get open enough times and you look to him less frequently. Conversely, Eli knows that Smith can get open on 3rd down and he looks for him.
looking at Ed's favorite, profootballfocus...
Diehl was atrocious last year. HORRIBLE. But the other 4, including Seubert, were in the top 30 of the league. All of them (including Seubert and McKenzie). I was surprised at this. O’Hara actually was the 2nd best OC in the NFL (behind Mangold)
I think the LT experiment overall was a success…but he probably does need to go back to OG. Its time to change the guard there (well…tackle). Seubert can be depth and Beatty needs to be the LT.
I hope they realize this and make sure Diehl doesn’t see any time, unless its an emergency, at LT next year.
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
by FreeBradshaw on Feb 7, 2010 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
So you think Beatty can step in at left tackle?
by giant fan since 57 on Feb 7, 2010 3:33 PM EST up reply actions
I think they gotta find out.
He seems to be the future of that position. He doesn’t seem like a RT, as he’s a better pass blocker then run blocker.
One of his knocks is his run blocking, tho I dunno why. Donal Brown ran for 2000 yards at UCONN with Beatty as the LT…and I don’t see any other OL who got drafted from UCONN, just Beatty.
He had to be doing something right in the running game….
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
I saw nothing wrong with Beatty
I think that his run blocking is fine, he isn’t Marc Colombo, but he gets the job done.
Everything that I have read or heard from Beatty, indicates that he is on track or better, I assume that he will start at LT next year. I assume that Diehl will slide over to LG.
McKenzie is getting towards the end of his career. 10 years in the trenches is a long time. They need to find a RT for 2011 this year. (Even though his contract expires after 2011, better to have a guy trained and ready in case McKenzie only has 9 years in him)
definitely
It will be tough to find a FA RT like McKenzie with all the RFA’s this year, so yea, they better be drafting one.
I dunno about the first round, tho I wouldn’t be against it, but I’m sure someone like Ciron Black could fall to them in the 3rd. He played LT in college, is said to be more of an OG, but I think with the Giants line coach being as good as he is, getting a guy with Black’s talent and just letting him learn, he could be a good RT for a long time.
He’s bigger then Mckenzie too. Be nice to see him as a FB on goal lines !
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
There are several
intriguing RT prospects in this years draft. I haven’t seen this guy but he is intriguing:
Ramon Harewood.
6-6 360, with a 3.0 in applied physics and engineering at Morehouse, with a history of playing rugby and soccer (violence and finesse). No way the NFL is to complex for an engineer.
I think of him as an UDFA, but would love to see him on practice squad for a season.
That's a large person....
Haven’t even heard that name either, but yea, seems like an intriguing prospect.
Maybe him and Goff as the 2 engineers on the team can engineer the Giants back to SB form?
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
by FreeBradshaw on Feb 8, 2010 10:58 AM EST up reply actions
I agree
I agree with your assessment of our Giants. I really like how you stated Ross needs to get on the field period, whether at CB or S he needs to be on the field. Also the LB Corp isn’t solid at all we need a MLB who is a field general and a banger. I agree that Pierce can’t be our starter anymore and Kehl, Goff have yet to show they are ready for the job. As for Sintim he is a project which we will have to work with but I like his athleticism and DC P-Fuel should get a lot out of him.I can’t agree more about Canty! This guy got paid and didn’t do anything this year. He can’t get up the field, he get’s stopped on his initial rush by tackles and even TE. Once he gets hit he fades away, we need more out of him. As for receivers I expect Manningham to be a better route runner, he had issues with running to close to the sidelines and not giving Eli space to place the ball. Hakeem Nicks did well in his first year but I want him to get stronger, and Steve Smith in my opinion needs to get stronger as well. As for the receiving Corps as a whole I want to see more YAC yards. I think it’s too early to say we can get back to the big game. I need to see the draft and who we pick up in free agency.
I think so
There were so many reasons to explain why they were bad. All the RB’s were hurt (I can’t believe Jacobs had that injury from game one….that explains EVERYTHING!), Tuck and Robbins the main inside pass rushers…age, injury (offseason or inseason) took their toll.
Many others of coruse…but the fact remains lots of these guys are young, so they should be back (and they’ve had a longer offseason too!! YAY!)
The only question I’ll say….since most are expecting the passing game to get better or at least be more consistent…do they? Does that take a dump next year?
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
Do you believe in Jerry Reese??
Do you believe in the Tom Coughlin?
These 2 will make or break the team. Obviously the DC didn’t work out, and the players underperformed on D. IF you think that they can identify the areas that need the most attention. Understand who can help going forward and who has to be replaced, then the Giants have a great chance to get back to the Super Bowl.
You don’t need a great defense to get to or win a Super Bowl, you just need a competent defense. If the Giants D was simply mediocre last season they probably win 10 or 11 and make the playoffs.
It isn’t so hard to see the Giants D improving to mediocre. That should be enough.
the Giants defense was 17th in 2007 (by points...)
so yes, mediocre in the reg. season is good. They were better across the board then that in yards and of course led the league in sacks, but overall..mediocre in the reg. season (what gives? Red zone defense?…maybe on defense its the green zone and on offense its the red zone?)
BTW 2008 they were 5th. So ‘elite’ didn’t do much for em.
2009….30th. Didn’t help much either.
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
by FreeBradshaw on Feb 7, 2010 10:48 AM EST up reply actions
Simply saying
that you don’t need an all world defense to get to the Super Bowl. But you won’t get there with an awful one.
I think that this draft could move them back to OK, I doubt everyone on the defense got bad at once. I expect bounce back seasons, just don’t ask me who.
I was agreeing with your point, just sorta emphasizing it :)
Everytime I see that the Giants D was 17th overall in 2007 is eye popping, I though they were so much better then that.
Also, the Patriots were 4th that year. Which angers me everytime I have to argue with some fool saying that the Giants D was the only reason they won the SB, like Eli had a cakewalk against the 4th ranked defense in the NFL
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
diehl was getting abused in that super bowl
on the last drive adalius thomas was in eli’s face on every snap
by mclaren_is_the_best on Feb 8, 2010 3:11 AM EST up reply actions
Well Eli threw the ball almost instantly on that play
but if you watch the whole drive you will see an Eli under pressure
by mclaren_is_the_best on Feb 8, 2010 5:55 PM EST up reply actions
Making the right play at the right time
speaks to me more than stats. Stopping that key third down, catching that INT instead of watching it go through the hands, making a great punt, kicking a chip-shot field goal.
Make the play when it absolutely has to be made. Forcing your will onto someone when it absolutely has to happen. That’s what we need.
We didn't even have a chance for the "perfect season", but we did have the perfect ending.
it just seemed like everything that could have went wrong did....
from the coaching/play calling to the execution, to injuries, penalties, etc, etc, etc.
with that being said we can get back to winning if we can get to the QB w/ a 4 man front. If Tuck can get healthy along with Canty and Osi we should be able to do that next season. From the sounds of it Fewell will improve this secondary so if he can get some help up front we’ll immediately improve on Defense.
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
Murphy's Law really shat on us this year
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
If the Running game comers back
that will be a huge boon to the defense, which spent more time on the field this year than in previous years. Clock control was something that was no longer a strength of the Giants, and it set the defense up to get burned more frequently (not that they needed the help, mind you). As for defense, a push up the middle and a a more athletic MLB would make the secondary look LOADS better. As for the LB specifically, if Sintim can learn to be more than just a pass rusher and the Giants get that speedy MLB, then you can couple that with Boley to see the most athletic LB corps the Giants have had since… the early 90’s?
I still have faith in Osi, Tuck, Kiwi, Cofield, and Tollefson (in the role he plays). Canty needs to step it up, and he needs to have some new blood join him and Cofield to get an actual push up the middle this year.
Osi has to change his path to the QB
There’s no way he can just run around the outside, then past, then come up from behind. I got sick of seeing this from him. By the time he got to the QB, the ball had been out of the QB’s hands for 2 seconds. Many claim it’s a mental block but we’ll see. Hopefully he proves them right.
We didn't even have a chance for the "perfect season", but we did have the perfect ending.
Half Full
I feel that we should have had back to back championships..with that said..a few tweaks here and there and I am 100 % certain we will be back in the SB in the very NEAR/NOW future..Hey if Peyton wins today,Eli can follow as he did the last time….
Regroup refocus..retool...
Until the shooting
We were the best team in football that year.
Not to take away from the saints amazing run
But they had a TON of luck along the way. While eating lunch, I saw cbs’ road to the superbowl, and everything bounced the right way for the saints.
When everyone is so skilled at this level, good bounces are what make the elite the elite, not so much because they have more talent necessarily.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
Saints shouldn't a been in the SB!
But, I’m actually happy for them, now that it’s over
You play to win the game!
by Simms-McConkey on Feb 8, 2010 8:11 AM EST up reply actions
This sums up the 2007 Giants to a tee
Even more so than the 2009 Saints, who showed signs of brilliance throughout the regular season.
THe 2007 Giants were the luckiest/flukiest postseason team in the history of the Super Bowl
says the Eagles fan.
go rent some videos of that playoff run, Giants were the better team in all 4 playoff games.
Why do you people love trolling so much?
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
Id be pretty mad too
if my team failed in 4 consecutive nfc championship games
hey guys were a crap version of the 90s bills!
by mclaren_is_the_best on Feb 8, 2010 10:10 PM EST up reply actions
Helps
him sleep better at night.
15 is a good number
by I_Formation27 on Feb 9, 2010 10:19 AM EST up reply actions
waaaaaaaait
gary bracket is an unrestricted free agent this offseason? Is he not perfect for the cover 2 system, and also a smart, veteran middle linebacker that could be a defensive leader?
how has no one mentioned that yet?
That should be our top target, he is still an elite MLB
I like this idea
seems a lot like Pierce, except the Tampa 2 version.
Cost a whole lot less then someone like Dansby too (who may not fit…he’s a OLB), so he’s probably a good bet if the Colts don’t re-up him (they may be spending dough on that Peyton guy to worry about Brackett)
Rectum? Damn near killed em!
We surely can be!
We have done it before, and we will do it again!
We didn't even have a chance for the "perfect season", but we did have the perfect ending.
I think it's entirely possible...
maybe even next year. I know it sounds silly considering how awful they were last year, but this was a season where almost EVERYTHING went wrong. A return to health from most of the MASH unit, a competent DC and a few more pieces and it could happen.
Most important, they need to win the battle at the line of scrimmage on defense. If they can collapse the pocket up the middle, our edge rushers can dominate again. Our corners are pretty good when healthy and the pass rush can help cover the flaws at linebacker and safety. Offensively, they’re plenty good (again with better health and tweaking the O-line a bit).
But without a serious upgrade at DT (maybe Canty will show up) it’s a pipe dream. I hardly ever favor trading up in the draft, but if there’s any chance to get Spags to part with the top pick, we should do it. Suh is the best D-Line prospect I’ve seen (never saw Reggie White in college), better than Sapp even. Giants D-line would be terrifying with Suh occupying 2 blockers every down. The question is what would it take to get him? I’m thinking something like the #15, next years first and a second or third this year. That said, if that’s what it took, I’d pull the trigger in a heartbeat.
Giants football
I’d be happy if we tried to get back to Giant football. I know everyone and their mother has jumped ship and turned this into a passing league, us included (which despite great numbers, won us only 8 games), but I think there is and always will be a place for a ball control, running offense and great D.
It’s fantastic we found all the talent we have at WR, possibly the best group in our history, but I honestly can’t see us winning another Super Bowl having Eli emulate his brother. I don’t think we’re a passing team, at least like Indy, NO, NE, and we’re currently not built for it. We’d need to completely change our O-line, who dominated not 2 years ago in the run game, and get pass protectors in. Scrap Jacobs, why bother having a bruiser at RB? Expensive blocker if all we do is pass. Although Gilbride’s pass first (and second, and toss to Jacobs third) mentality seems right. It’s great to have the new found talent at WR, but I’m sure they could be utilized quite often still with a run first game plan.
Offense/game plan/identity aside, obviously the D needs to improve. You’ve all got the right idea, I take a bit from all of them. Pressure up front, to me is #1.
So yeah, we can get back to the promised land. Soon too. But Fewell needs to be our answer to Spags, which may be unlikely so soon, but not unheard of. Still a lot remains on D from 2 years ago. And again, just my opinion, but I don’t think we’ll get there on O with a pass happy game plan. If for no other reason than where we play, and who we play. We don’t have the luxury of playing in dome 8/16 games, if not more. And yes, teams do it (NE, GB) but they have the right personnel to do so. We don’t right now. I’m still optimistic.
"Uh-huh, uh-huh. Okay. Um, can you repeat the part of the stuff where you said all about the...things? Uh… the things?" - Homer Simpson
This entry got me thinking
statistically, which was the best offense in giants history?
by mclaren_is_the_best on Feb 8, 2010 3:16 AM EST reply actions
Check yourself
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyg/
This was the 4th best year pt wise, but the 2nd worst in giving up points
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
man when you look at that
It makes 2008 all that much more disappointing.
If it wasn’t for PLAXICO that could’ve been the most dominating NYG team ever.
Especially when you take into consideration that we also beat the Steelers, Ravens, Eagles and Cardinals (the 4 teams that competed in the AFC / NFC championship games)
by mclaren_is_the_best on Feb 8, 2010 6:02 PM EST up reply actions
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