New York Giants notes: Romeo, Oh, Romeo
by Ed Valentine on Jan 8, 2010 7:00 AM EST
in News
141 comments
Settle in, folks. It looks like this whole find a new defensive coordinator process is going to take the New York Giants a while.
Former Buffalo Bills defensive coordinator and interim head coach Perry Fewell interviewed Thursday with Tom Coughlin. A source told Ralph Vacchiano of the New York Daily News that Fewell is a 'serious' candidate for the job.
Of course, he is far from the only one. It appears likely that the Giants will be setting up a meeting with Romeo Crennel, the former Cleveland coach and former New England defensive coordinator next week.
NorthJersey.com's Vinny DiTrani, a reporter I don't link to often, weighs in with his feelings that Fewell and Pepper Johnson are the best candidates for the job.
Of all the rumored candidates for the Giants' defensive coordinator position, two appear to fit the criteria better than the others. One is Perry Fewell, the former Buffalo defensive coordinator and interim head coach, who will interview today for the position vacated by Bill Sheridan.
The other is New England defensive line coach Pepper Johnson, the former Giants' linebacker who is busy with the Patriots in the playoffs. Other potential candidates might become available in the next week or so. But these two appear to best fit the profile the Giants have established.
Both are charismatic coaches who could supply much needed energy to a unit that appeared to sleepwalk through the final half of the season.
Fewell is a 4-3 coach, which is the defense the Giants prefer to run and have accumulated the personnel to run. Johnson always has been involved with the Belichick 3-4, so either he or the Giants would have to adjust.
Vacchiano also recently laid out a case for and against Johnson.
The pluses are obvious: The man knows defense. He comes from the Bill Belichick coaching tree (and, thus, the Parcells tree, too). He has five Super Bowl rings, including two as a player, and he’d command instant respect when he walked into that locker room. He’s an imposing presence who wouldn’t be intimidated by anyone. The players would listen. They’d be inspired. And it’s a good bet he’d tap into many former great Giants defensive players who are just dying to help out.
The negatives are obvious, too: He’s never been a defensive coordinator. That lack of experience didn’t work out so well for Bill Sheridan, though it didn’t seem to bother Steve Spagnuolo.
Vacchiano, who is apparently working way too hard these days, also says you can cross Miami assistant George Edwards off the list (sorry, Gobs). Edwards is taking a job the DC job at the University of Florida.
(E-mail Ed at bigblueview@gmail.com)
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I have my doubts about Crennel...
…statistically speaking, the numbers aren’t good for former HCs once they have appeared in a Coors Light commercial in terms of returning to the pro ranks.
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 7:51 AM EST reply actions
You can be sure
That if we hired Crennel there would be hoopla involved.
by SonictheHedgecock on Jan 8, 2010 10:19 AM EST up reply actions
It's from the
Coors Light commericial.
i’d link it but I’m at work and doubt I could find it through the filter.
Sign me up....
for Romeo or Pepper. Of all the names floating, those two seem be best fits to my completely biased personal opinion.
How about
Fewell for DC
Peppers for line coach.
Hey now!
You know whats odd about that
I had a similar thought about that. We have only canned the DC and DL coach so far? Does it stop there, who knows? What does Pepper do, coaches the DL and could become our DC too. A two for one hire?
Why would Pepper make a lateral move?
Just because he played for us? He’s got 3 rings as a position coach with Belichek, and the P’s offer him a realistic chance at adding another ring every year. What would be the incentive for him to transfer?
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 9:05 AM EST up reply actions
$$$$
and to coach for his loved former team. I think if the price is right he could make a lateral move. Getting Pepper and fewell/romeo would be great
by Gmen Fan in Gmen Land on Jan 8, 2010 9:10 AM EST up reply actions
Getting Pepper and fewell/romeo would be great
and it would also be a pipe dream.
In order for us to get him to accept a lateral move it would take more money than the P’s currently pay him. Why would the organization offer him more than the market rate for his services when there are plenty of other suitable position coaches out there — just because he is a former Giant?
Either Pepper comes as DC or he doesn’t come at all. Mark it 8, dude.
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 9:21 AM EST up reply actions
If it was strictly a lateral move, why wouldn't Pepper want to come here?
I don’t think it’s all about staying in one place because of the chance to win rings. If that was the case, then 3/4’s of the NFL wouldn’t have coaches. The lure can be a number of reasons why coaches move on, even if it is lateral. Obviously money is a factor, but i also believe that coaches have personal preferences of where they would like to go, or end up. So in some aspects, it’s not all about money, but going home so to speak, where they started their career.
Alot of championship-caliber teams are stripped of their coaches, and alot of them are lateral moves. So you wonder, why did these coaches go here or there? Even with saying that, there may have been other suitable coaches too, but did they fit the mold you were looking for, or did they seem indifferent with the situation? It’s all about being comfortable with where you are at. If your being sought after, and that certain opportunity is what your looking for, that opportunity may never happen again.
So if Pepper ever wanted to become part of the Giants organization again in any compacity, whether it was a modest pay raise, the same wage or in some cases, some will take less to be where they want to be, i don’t see any reason why we couldn’t bring him aboard.
+1
He may also view the Patriots as a dead end with BB there. Coughlin may be more prone to retire or be replaced in the near future, so upward mobility could be a greater possibility with the Giants.
I think most coaches
view the Patriots as a stepping stone. The coordinators move to head jobs elsewhere, the assistants move up, then eventually become coordinators, then eventually HCs. If Pepper comes, it’s to be the DC, no less. Which, I wouldn’t mind. Or Crennel, for that matter. Maybe even Fewell. Any way we look at it, it’s going to be an improvement.
Very few of them have had success though
I mean, the most successful Belichick pupil to become a HC is probably mangini, and he’s not exactly lighting the world on fire.
Pepper I definitely think would be different, and as long as he won’t be the HC, we’ll be fine
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
because lateral moves can be perceived as not career-advancing if not insulting if one has ambitions of going further and feels like his time is now.
Coaching football is no different than any other career in that sense. A lot of it would come down to what Pepper wants, where he sees himself going, etc.
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
My whole thought was
When TC retires Fewell might move up and peppers as well to DC.
Just a thought.
I wouldn't consider a lateral move as insulting...
If someone chooses to do so? If they’re ambitious to achieve another level of importance, then along the way, theres bound to be self sacrifice. If, only for a couple of years, the wait would be worth it if you truly wanted to be where you wanted to go.
So if a person really wants to be at certain place regardless of circumstances, and the situation arises, it acts like, getting your foot in the door type of thing, and then you climb the ladder! Of course based on individual merits too, which the rewards will come!
By the looks of it, and regardless of our personnel
The possibility of transitioning to a 3-4 might not be so far fetched? I wouldn’t have thought this would be a reality a few weeks ago, but assuming if Pepper is a candidate and is a 3-4 guy, so far, 2/3’s of the candidates run 3-4’s!
I’m not sure who else is on the Giants DC list, but it looks like the Giants don’t care what system candidates may run. If KG and Palmer go, and we hire a 3-4 guy, what an interesting way to spend the off-season. Lots to talk about!
If we go 3-4
We need a pile of beef for the Nose and another ILB to pair with Boley. No way Be nard or Robbins could handle the NT. I think Osi, Sintim, Kiwi go at OLB, Tuck and Canty/Cofield at DE. Of course we need another safety too, but that’s regardless of scheme. How about that monster that ‘Bama was using as a lead blocker on Ingram’s first TD run? Is he coming out?
Terrance Cody
6’5, 360, that should do the trick in the middle… yeah, the LB McClain looks like he’d make a decent ILB too… while we’re at it, I’ll take Texas’ kicker, Ingram jr., and Dareus too. ha.
Yes he is...but prone to injuries..Can't get low enough and takes a beating..Obviously..
A great player, but he won’t last he’s already declining. A huge, fast off the snap 6’3" guy would be my choice.
and also...
Can’t stay on the field….
N8 !
by FreeBradshaw on Jan 8, 2010 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
I dont think
most NTs play every down. They have 2 or 3 and alternate them, which sucks for us because we dont even have 1!
Pretty sure Vince Wilfork is out there a lot..
Casey Hampton at least when he was younger was.
The point I was making on Cody..he wasn’t even out there 25% of the time..that #99 dude was.
N8 !
by FreeBradshaw on Jan 8, 2010 12:54 PM EST up reply actions
How much was Cody actually on the field last night?
He’s got all-world stength and I guess size…but he’s got no stamina.
At best he’s a 2-down player….and might even be a one down player.
..what the hell’s the point?
N8 !
by FreeBradshaw on Jan 8, 2010 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
it Romeo hits the weights a little...
…he might be able to play Nose for us in a 3-4. He looks like he could clog up a lot of space in the middle.
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 9:03 AM EST up reply actions
I can def see us going to a 3-4 …. Tuck,Osi,and Canty up Front.. Kiwi, Boley, Sintim, and Goff in the back. Pretty athletic group of guys if you ask me
+1
I think Tuck and Canty are built to be 3-4 DEs and Sintim and Kiwi can definitely play 3-4 OLBs. I think Cofield would be a serviceable NT. I think they need to upgrade the ILB position. Boley would be good, but I don’t know about Goff. I would trade Osi, who is a pure 4-3 DE, and get an upgrade at the ILB positon.
Tuck is not a 3-4 end
he would be wasted there
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jan 8, 2010 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
After last night's performance, I am more sold on this guy than ever.
He clearly possesses the ability to step up and make big plays, which is an important criteria for me, of course…
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 9:02 AM EST up reply actions
no chance
The Fins have already expressed interest and the pick at 12…
The ILB we should start paying attn to in Darryl Washington from TCU. I’ve mentioned him before, to me he’s every bit as good a prospect as Mclain… the only difference is we wouldn’t get to say yippe kaiyay Mother F’er all day long.
Ralph doesn't give you much
He’ll have a nugget here and there but if you want constant information, he’s certainly not on my list of reporters to visit. Personally, I’ll always remember him for his comments at the Super Bowl, which can be seen in this wonderful video.
There goes that exclusive interview Ed
Yeah he mentioned the UF spot didn’t know he took it until last night, guess he isn’t coming camping and 4wheeling with my family this weekend… Oh well, I guess I’m going Fewell first and Pepper 2nd… not sure I want Romeo at all though, does anyone like him with us?
In football, you can always maim a person if you wanted to. -L.T.
Crennel
would make Sheridan look like Vince Lombardi in terms of his ability to inspire his players. And he hasn’t shown that he’s anything without Belichick.
ageed
there is a reason he’s made to look like a fool in that coors add… he is one. Gimme Pepper and draft Hughes for NT or trade Osi to STL and get Suh for the 3-4. It’d be fun just to watch something different next year, not that this year wasn’t a blast. As i remember it through the bottom of my 12th pint glass we looked pretty dominant with the current 4-3 set up
when has anybody has success in cleveland?
id take crennel any day of the week
oops I crapped my pants!
Should have downed a thirteenth.
You can see the whole world through that one.
neither has Pepper Johnson
in fact, most successful assistant coaches haven’t shown they are anything without their head coach.
2009 Did Not Happen
But
we know that Belichik ran the show in NE, so all I know about Romeo is that he spent a feww years in Cleveland with the same expression on his face on the sidelines and came off as a little clueless in his interactions with the press.
I still don't understand why people are so caught up in expressions and press interactions.
3/4 of the players don’t pay attention to the press interactions.
Also..Bill Belicheck looks like and idiot in the press interactions..and sounds like a fool as he stutters through them too.
…doesn’t take away from the fact he’s a great football mind.
N8 !
Belicheck?
3SB’s?
2 with the Giants?
Pretty much all of em cuz of his defense. Unless you’re asking something else?
N8 !
And one of the big cpmplaints about Sheridan
is that he was unable to fire up his players. Demeanor does factor into it.
He's like Parcells..he doesn't even want to deal with the press..they are idiots..
These cigar smoking goof-balls don’t work 24X7 putting a game plan together..They are Gnats looking for a bone to gnaw on in their idiotic articles..BB and BP always consider them and irratant, win OR lose..“Get lost I have an upcoming game to worry about and your holding me up”…
+1
Everything BP does struggles to mask his contempt for the NFL for all of the hoops the league makes a HC jump through, from the cut-off sweatshirts, to the brusque press conferences, to the fudged injury reports, to Spygate…
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 4:07 PM EST up reply actions
I like Pepper, I like Crennel
I think Perry Fewell is the man for the job.
He’s young and fiery like Pepper…but he’s more experienced and actually had a young and not all that talented Buffalo squad along the middle of the pack as far as team defense is concerned.
THeir pass defense was 2nd in the league right behind the Jets.
Someone name a player on the Bills defense? He had injures there too….and they were 2nd in teh league in pass defense.
Fewell’s the man.
Crennell or Pepper would be fine too. Fewell’s better.
N8 !
Bruce Smith
oh, you meant current players? Never mind – I didn’t even know they still played football in Buffalo
2009 Did Not Happen
They may not be much longer..
Seems like they plan on desecrateing “Buffalo Bill”…
they play it only part-time in Buffalo now...
…and part time in Toronto
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
The Giants played in Buffalo two years ago. :-)
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by MattRichWarren on Jan 8, 2010 1:39 PM EST up reply actions
The thing I can see with Fewell is
our D-Backs getting a lot better. That seems to his MO as a coah. Hell I remeber when Spags took over for Tim Lewis how much better the D-Backs got.
We have some good ones, well at least at the CB position so guys like C-Web, TT, and even Ross if healthy might really blossom under Fewell.
The one problem is they were awful against the run though, so teams ran against them a lot . . . You’re ritght though other than Paul Podloski and Kawika Mitchell who was injured all year I can’t name a guy on their D so maybe that was a talent issue . . . I would’nt mind seeing Fewell get the job.
I just think that while
some here complain that there’s a lack of talent in NY…there really isn’t.
Buffalo…well, there really is a lack of talent. They had their share of injuries too…and…
Pass defense #2 in the league. Who really gives a crap HOW they did it? They didn’t set the world on fire with sacks…but they were #2 in pass defense!
The Giants all in all..with Sheridan here..were middle of the road against the run, even after those last 2 games…
I think the Giants can at the very least under Fewell maintain that run defense (and probably improve) and the sacks thing could work itself out too.
The pass defense, and secondary in particular…is like you said his specialty.
…wasn’t Spags a DB’s coach?
Boom.
N8 !
by FreeBradshaw on Jan 8, 2010 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
because you can just run the ball on them
no point in trying to pass when anyone could run all over them
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jan 8, 2010 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
Or...
because they play the Jets twice (#1 in the NFL) the Dolphins twice (all they do is run the ball) and they played the Titans (CJ had 2000 yards..no one stopped him).
They did well against Brees and the Saints, Shaub and the Texans..and of course..Brady didn’t do squat against them.
They don’t have the players to stop the run. I’m not sure the Giants do either after this season…but I’m certain they do have the players to stop it more then the Bills do.
The fact the Giants were average against the run..under Sheridan, should body well for Fewell on the Giants.
I’m more worried about stopping the pass anyway….McNabb and Romo lit the Giants up at times..as did many others.
N8 !
If i can recall, they had 14 players on the IR...
Byrd, Denney, Draft, DiGiorgio, Kelsay, Maybin, McGee, Posluzny, Wilson…
I should know more from my fantasy league.
Byrd, Digiorgio, McGee are the only folks from that list that were injured. We lost both starting CBs in Terrence McGee and Leodis McKelvin, our starting SS was out for half the year in Donte Whitner. Our LB corps was the one that was destroyed with Kawika, Nic Harris, Marcus Buggs, and Digi going down to season-enders and Poz being out for a month. Crazy.
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by MattRichWarren on Jan 8, 2010 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
If I'm not mistaken..
the real problem in Buffalo was the offense wasn’t it?
D wasn’t great..but with what was or wasn’t on the field week in and out…being the #2 pass defense in the league was not just some smoke and mirrors job was it?
N8 !
i see some talk about the 3-4
my how things have changed….
I myself didn’t think this was an option, but i’m trying to warm up to it.
what worries me….aside from no NT. I don’t like Osi at DE in a 3-4.
I think Kiwi can play OLB but not sure about Osi on the end.
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
Osi's not gonna be a 3-4 DE...
he’ll be a OLB.
It could work.
But look at Aaron Kampman in GB….it just didn’t work out for him in 2009 at OLB..and I’d say he’s a lot like Osi and Tuck.
The thing is…while we all can feel that Osi and Tuck have bounce back years..no one, even those guys themselves..don’t know that.
Coughlin I believe said it best…the idea is to get better in 2010..and it doesn’t matter how.
N8 !
by FreeBradshaw on Jan 8, 2010 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
I'd certainly rather have Osi at OLB than DE in a 3-4
but at the same time i think Kiwi would excel in that role….
Hell i know he’s cheap but if we do go 3-4 i’d look to move Osi….
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
no doubt..
I think JR’s words on Osi..that he’s ‘part of the plan here’..was more of talking him up to retain his value.
I mean…its not really out of the question that Osi can be good as a OLB…guys have done it before.
Some players…like Julius Peppers for instance..WANT to be a 3-4 OLB.
Maybe Osi does too?
N8 !
by FreeBradshaw on Jan 8, 2010 10:43 AM EST up reply actions
yeah, Osi's attitude could be a big factor into that move....
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
I'd also like to retract my statement
that MG was just throwing names out there to keep up with RV….seems like the giants are genuinely interested in Romeo (and vice versa)
good call MG…but still RV > MG
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
The 2010 Giants and the 3-4
http://blogs.nfl.com/2009/07/08/the-3-4-defense-isnt-as-easy-as-it-sounds/
Using that 5-point list, let’s look at the viability of the Giants running the 3-4 next season.
1. Overall, would we really consider our defense a smart defense? I wouldn’t. I’m not saying that they don’t have any football IQ – that would be ridiculous – but the switch from a 4-3 to a 3-4 defense isn’t an easy one. The responsibilities are completely different. That being said, the Packers have done well in their transition. Using that as my example, I believe that unless a player is just obtuse, the right coach can do a serviceable job teaching a talented unit the defense in one year. It’s about getting the right DC to be that teacher.
2. We definitely have hybrids. Osi and Kiwi are capable of being part OLB and part DE. Kiwi played a season as a LB. Osi likes to rush the passer, a staple of the OLB, and is one of the more athletic guys on the defense (when healthy). Also, don’t forget that both Sintim and Kehl come were 3-4 LBs and might excel at it in the pros.
3. See #2.
4. The NT position is the biggest issue. The Giants can’t really expect Alford to return to his pre-injury form. Osi, Robbins, and Cofield all had injuries in their legs and neither one of them returned as strongly the next year as we had hoped. I understand that Alford is younger but it’s still not a given. Besides that, do we really think that Alford would be good enough to wreak havoc as a NT? I’m not so sure. This isn’t a position that you can skimp on but free agency will be too expensive (see the Haynesworth contract). Look to the draft. Suh (Nebraska), Cody (Bama), and Jones (Cuse) are the big names but very good players like Oghobaase (Duke) and Smith (La. Tech) will be available in the late 1st/early 2nd. The Giants could still get their safety in the 1st round and trade up for the right DT.
5. A 3-4 DE is like a 4-3 DT. You need size on the strong-side to occupy O-linemen since that’s the pass rushing side for LBs. You need speed on the weak-side since the weak-side LB is going to be in coverage most of the time. Let’s put Canty on the strong-side. He was the 3-4 DE playing alongside Ware when Ware had his 20-sack season. On the weak-side, Tuck could be the speedy DE. Julius Peppers played the 3-4 DE and hated it; the physical beating he took really cost him in his productivity. However, he was on the strong-side. Aaron Curry and Richard Seymour are weak-side 3-4 DEs and they’ve been excellent players. Both Canty and Tuck play the run well and that’s a must for 3-4 DEs. We could have Cofield as Canty’s backup and Kiwi as Tuck’s backup.
While I don’t necessarily feel that the Giants need to switch defensive schemes, I’d conclude that the 3-4 is a viable option for the 2010 Giants.
Wouldn't it be ironic
if we did switch to the 3-4 and Osi became the second coming of LT? Rushing around the end like a wild dog, terrorizing every QB in his wake? imagine……..not gonna happen, but its fun to think of the possibilities.
that is another concern of mine....
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
well Merriam-Webster defines it as… The guy wont get to edge rush. He will be getting chipped from all sides on the inside because lets face it, Tuck is not covering anyone in space. How does the line go: when youve got a thoroughbred, you dont lock him in the barn.
JEEZ
One bad year. A year with numerous injuries. A year with a new and incapable DC. Now some want to change to a 3-4.
Yea Frank..I have been saying the same thing all along..One last time..we are built specifically..
For a 4-3..Fix-it..and don’t fix what ain’t broke..I want our 4-3 coming out of the shute fixed and on fire, and don’t want to wait a year or two for a frigging 3-4 to evolve.
Its not us wanting it
It just seems like the Giants are open to change to it, most of the DC’s we are looking at are 3-4 system oriented, plus spags run alot of 3-4 looks with our team, not sure how many of us actually want to go thru the change and growing pains but we are getting the feeling from the team they might want to go in that direction… And because of that I think we are just trying to discuss how we could pull it off just incase it happens… who knows what there going to do
In football, you can always maim a person if you wanted to. -L.T.
exactly...
those that WANT it are blind…the Giants aren’t the GB Packers, they don’t have a slew of LB’s and a bunch of 330lbs DT’s waltzing around.
But those that don’t think its possible are just as blind.
They’re interviewing Romeo Crennel. They fired Wauffle (making it possible for a new DC to switch).
Also..everyone and their mother lately wants Pepper Johnson as the DC. I dunno how the hell he could possibly run a 4-3…Pepper played in a 3-4 and coaches in a 3-4 now.
Its possible…
N8 !
by FreeBradshaw on Jan 8, 2010 12:56 PM EST up reply actions
I'm a fan
I’m not a coach. Like many I’m probably very naive when it comes to certain technical issues. IMO most coaches at this level would have very little difficulty coaching a 34 vs 43. I’d rather have a young guy with fire. That would rile up the ‘crazed dogs’ than another statue on the sidelines or in the booth.. We have that in our HC and OC. Spags was a good compliment. He had a fiery personality. That’s needed for defense.
I'm pretty sure there's a reason
why a DC or even HC is said to ‘run a 3-4’…and always runs a 3-4. Or runs a 4-3 and always uses a 4-3..
The coach uses what they use…cuz that’s what they know.
A right handed person’s not gonna throw lefty cuz a team needs a left handed thrower…
You go with what you know.
And i have doubts that Spags was this ‘fiery’ personality…he was a player coach..not a yeller.
N8 !
Fiery
you misunderstood. By fiery I don’t mean a coach that gets up in players faces then yells and screams. I meant a coach who coaches with some enthusiasm. Not some statue on the sidelines.
IMO that's on the players...
The Patriots, with Crennel there..were full of enthusiasm.
Again..I don’t care what the coach looks like when the camera pans to him…if the players are playing for him..that’s all that matters.
I’d rather a calm coach back there that doesn’t go nuts when something good or bad happens.
Even keel is probably better…
N8 !
+1000
Exactly, and oh by the way, try to get over to the bench kneel down in front of the squad and re-enforce what’s going on and what needs to be done during a game to fix it..don’t stand off to the side scratching your head and your balls..
This
watching old games, you always see Belichick on the sidelines telling his players what to do better, what to look for, what to do in what situation.
Someone should have given Sheridan a marker board and tell him to use it.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
I wouldn't
interpret interviewing possible DC jobs as the Giants are open to change. We didn’t have enough capable LBs for a 4-3. IMO the Kiwi LB experiment was a disaster. Converting Osi and/or Kiwi wouldn’t work. Our D personal is equipped for a 43.
really?
why would they waste theirs or Romeo’s time by interviewing him then?
Romeo runs the 3-4….he’s in for an interview, they’re open to moving to it.
N8 !
First
it might be a formality. Covering their bases in the minority interview process.
Second, after last years hiring debacle I’m sure Mara and TC want to cover all bases. I wouldn’t classify it as a waste of time.
Finally, do you think Romeo is incapable of coaching a 43? Again, I might be naive but most DCs at this level would have little problems coaching a 34 or 43. JMO
They interviewed Perry Fewell first...
tho, there is no “Rooney rule” for coordinators anyway…Fewell and Crennel are basically the best available, aside from maybe Dick Jauron, and most experience as DC’s.
Romeo has plenty of options…maybe the Giants are not wasting their time…but I doubt Romeo would waste his own time if there was no chance.
And no…Romeo’s a 3-4 guy…they might show some 4-3 looks..but the base D is a 3-4.
N8 !
waste of time?
teams often interview candidates for jobs that they really have no intention of hiring. At times the unexpected guy jumps off the page at them.
is as much a candidate
as any.
Giants are exploring all options..yea.
Romeo’s one of the best defensive minds in the NFL..so of course he is a legit candidate.
N8 !
Caveat
the only way the Giants go to a 34 is they sign a few FA LBs. They need the bodies. They can do it for 2010 since it’s an uncapped year. However, after last season’s FA signing disaster I’d be surprised if the Giants go crazy in the FA market.
no doubt...
I’ve stated before I’d rather stay with the 3-4.
But also..I’ve said that there are players on the roster than could make it work, especially with a mind like Crennel at the helm.
Of course there would be what to do with guys like Osi and Tuck (well..trade Osi…that’s pretty easy and probably should happen anyway)
Guys like Richard Seymour are out there..and could be the Giants Bart Scott+ Rex Ryan type deal with Crennel coming here.
And yea…they’d need some LB’s..tho I disagree on Kiwi, I think as a 3-4 OLB he’d be a lot less ‘lost’ out there (tho towards the end, he was getting better as a SLB). Sintim is a 3-4 OLB anyway, Boley could be a good coverage ILB..maybe Goff pans out.
The biggest need is a true NT.
N8 !
I actually think Kiwi would do rather well in a 3-4
now that does not mean i’m voting to change to a 3-4….
but i think if he can just worry about rushing the passer (and not having to worry so much about coverage like he did in a 4-3) he’ll be improved. Plus w/ his speed and agility I think he’ll benefit from playing off the line….while still being allowed to rush the passer and blitz.
I just don’t know if he’s big enough and physical enough to be a full time DE in a 4-3. As we’ve witnessed he’s not all that much better than Osi against the run and i think he relies too much on his outside speed rush….which can be a problem when it’s not a passing play and he leaves zero contain on the corner.
Osi’s guilty of that too…
I guess if Kiwi puts on some more weight he could be better in a 4-3 but i think right now he would be fine in a 3-4 as an OLB.
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
Disagree
Kiwi looked lost as a LB. Granted it was short lived but after this past season the Giants can’t afford to enter 2010 ‘experimenting’.
He was coming around on it
right before he busted his leg. He was VERY lost for the start of it, but he was shaping up nicely.
but also bear in mind that was in a 4-3.
in a 4-3 the LB’s have a larger set of responsibilities. They have to worry about pass coverage more than rushing the QB and probably are equally concerned w/ stopping the run.
in a 3-4 we could free Kiwi up to focus more as a pass rusher….and by putting him off the line he won’t have to worry about some 300 OT mauling him from the snap. I think his speed becomes more of a factor in a 3-4 as well.
In fact, i forget what team it was….but Ed has asked the opposing blogger who they would want (from the Giants)…and the guys first choice was Kiwi…as OLB in their 3-4 defense. Not that it means anything, but it would be totally different from playing LB in a 4-3.
Image Demarcus Ware as a 4-3 Linebacker….he’d get beat in coverage repeatedly….so Dallas uses him primarily as a pass rusher.
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
Don't get me wrong..it is fun to talk about..just not going to happen..Our offense will be at a peak level.
This year..If the team tried to transistion to a 3-4..We will all be talking about our Offense in decline..Again fun to talk about but not realistic..Like I said our defense isn’t broken..bruised maybe, but not broke..and those guys are embarrassed, and will be for the next several months..They get to study their pathetic performances while being forced to watch what could have been and should have been..that is misery..Carson Palmer said it the other day, that there is no worse torture as a player then being on the outside looking in..
if the Giants defense was mediocre...
they would be in the playoffs.
To be honest…if they really..really make an honest attempt to get just a few players here and there…like a NT, maybe another 3-4 DE or 2 (Seymour…well..regardless of the scheme, should be a Giant)..and maybe a ILB or 2…they’d be fine.
And look…our team needs…DT, LB, basically what they’d need anyway regardless of the scheme..and that DT could be the 3-4 DE they need. Of course there’s that secondary thing that needs to be addressed too.
There’s no question there’s be growing pains…but there will probably be growing pains regardless.
The overall point is get a DC..no matte the scheme, that knows what he’s doing.
I could care less what the scheme is…cuz to be honest, the players didn’t exactly make a case that they fit the 4-3 last year, now did they?
I don’t think its realistic to think the D will be great in 2009, 4-3 or 3-4..
If they can manage to be mediocre..and hopefully if the offense trends up from this year…it really won’t matter.
I think the D can be mediocre in the 4-3 or mediocre learning the 3-4.
N8 !
Well Free...
I disagree…I’d love to get Seymour, I bet Al Davis forgets he even has him, but I truly believe that our 4-3 scheme will come out firing on all eight cylinders next season with an inspirational DC like Pepper Johnson..The respect he’ll command will cast a shadow..and somebody out here made the point that his fellow ex-warriors will be available to help..It is time for the Pepper to move up and be home…Shit he’s coaching the DL in NE..prior to that the LBs..what’s one more player in the 4-3 going to do to impact his ability?..He’s all about defense..and I think he can handle it…and he won’t accept mediocrity.
That's what I don't understand....
lots want Pepper…but don’t want the 3-4. I like Pepper too..and I really don’t care what scheme they play.
Pepper’s gonna run the 3-4 if he’s a DC. I mean all 3-4’s have some 4-3 looks..but the base D with Pepper in all likelihood is gonna be a 3-4.
What do you think he was doing for 10 years under BB and all those years playing with the Gints (playing under BB)?
If you don’t want the 3-4…you don’t want Pepper. If you want Pepper…you want the 3-4.
N8 !
I want Peppers for more than a 3-4..He can run a 4-3 and still transistion slowly if he so desires.
It is or would be his call as to how to put the defense he wants together without disrupting the unit we currently have..and cause a rift between where we are and where we want to be next season..He can run a 4-3 he is not a dope, while assessing what needs to be done long-term..We need to ensure that we take full advantage of this offense we have and can’t afford throwing more horseshit on top of our defense..We lose shoot-outs..How anybody can think a guy is one-dimensional as a defensive oriented guy is plain crazy..If anyone thinks a guy with his resume doesn’t know both schemes is crazy..Just get him here, let him work with what he has he isn’t stupid and he knows all defensive schemes. Alot of you guys think: “Oh he’s a 3-4 guy”..that is nuts !!..They know defense from all angles and can handle it..or oh, we need a secondary guy, he’d be (Fewel) great..That ain’t how it works..That just ain’t how it works..We need a guy that transends that and I think Pepper is that guy.
+1
How anybody can think a guy is one-dimensional as a defensive oriented guy is plain crazy
Agreed
alright...
I guess fair enough…
but name one guy who is called a ‘3-4 guy’ that went to another team and ran a 4-3 base D?
Could they do it? Sure.
Do they have any experience on a team that runs it? No.
So..name one. Then that will end it.
But if not..a 3-4 guy runs a 3-4 cuz that’s the scheme they know.
Its not just putting 3 down lineman instead of 4. Pretty sure there’s a lot more to it then that.
Same goes with the 4-3….DC’s run certain schemes cuz that’s what they know.
N8 !
Okay
Bill Parcells
Buddy Ryan
Dom Capers
Jim Johnson
..There’s four..that started out at least coordinating a 4-3 defense..There are many more.
..And there are offshoots to both a 3-4 and 4-3...
There are guys out here that can pull together a combination of both looks..and the league is long over-due for the guy that can invent a new look..and I’ll put my money on Pepper Johnson to do just that..His skill and intellect speaks for itself and he has many comrades to build this defense back to The Big Blue Wrecking Crew..I bet you whatever you want that he has ideas he hasn’t been unleashed to try out..I don’t consider him a rookie DC..I consider him a pit-bull.
You got it, Bobbi
That’s why he’s my first choice.
You know whats crazy about that Bobbi
I’ve been trying to think of ways on how we could keep Osi happy. He is a good pass rusher afterall. This is what i came up with. Regardless of DC and within our current roster, there would only have to be one move for this. Rather than a 4-3 or 3-4, i would call it a 3-1-3.
RE Kiwi
DT Canty / Cofield
LE Tuck
Osi would have the designation of the one.
WLB Boley
MLB Goff
SLB Sintim
Now how this may work would be this. Your pretty much playing your 4-3 personnel, but only having 3 down lineman. Depending on what the O is showing, Osi will have the freedom to rove amongst the line of scrimmage. Thus he’s always blitzing, but from different areas. Also, rather than have the DL to traditionally lineup as a 3-4 look, they too would likely be shifting.
Essentially, it may look like a 3-4, but after the snap, it plays like a 4-3. This goes without saying about the LB’s lining up on overloads of strong or weakside formations.
also
Pepper Johnson played LB and started as a LB coach. He’s now a d line coach. We often see coordinators become coaches. They learn to coach the other side of the ball.
Re: Romeo. It’s obvious Bill B has great respect for Romeo. He’s dragged Cannell with him at every stop. He’s followed BB to Cleveland, Jets, and NE. That’s good enough for me.
But in 2010
our D can be great in the 4-3 but very unlikely that it would be more than mediocre with a 3-4.
And Seymour will be a raider in 2010
by mclaren_is_the_best on Jan 8, 2010 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
again..
it depends on the coordinator…
these guys were great in the 4-3 in 2008..but sucked in 2009. Sheridan was a reason for it..but also a reason for it was cuz most of the guys that did play weren’t very good.
I don’t think its reasonable to expect a Green Bay like turnaround for the defense…but Green Bay did go from 4-3 to 3-4…so its possible.
It was cuz they had the players for the most part..but mostly cuz Dom Capers is an excellent defensive teacher.
Crennel is probably as good as Capers..if not better, as a DC.
Either could work..either could fail.
I agree, with the current crop of players (no draft, no FA signings) there really isn’t much to work with for a 3-4 switch.
But there’s plenty of new blood needed on the defense anyway. There’s versatility there…I mean, its not out of the question to make Tuck a 3-4 OLB, or at least a rush ILB.
A creative defensive mind…even if they are going with a base 3-4 cuz that’s what they know..will be able to make it work anyway.
Here in NYG land..I know its been a little while since creativity has been part of the equation…so hopefully this new dude has it (Crennel does.)
N8 !
I'm not interested in changing to the 3-4
but so many people have mentioned that I thought to discuss it.
hopefully that doesn't matter....
I was throwing his name out there too…
but Mangini is a fool.
N8 !
I'm not going to diss Mangini..yet..He took a job loaded with a bunch of..
Lazy, undisciplined coasters and slackers..and had to put his foot down..and this year ended with a 4 game winning streak and a Harry Carson bath..(that’s my new name for it…I declare all Gatorade jugs have “Harry Carsons Coach Bath” written on them..shit George Foreman has a grill, give Harry his justice!!)..Anyway I regressed, I think the Browns are heading in the right direction with Holmgren..He’s no dummy..and if he thinks Mangini is the guy, then he’s the guy..plus Holmgren rides a Harley !!
it's a pity that Carson couldn't trademark the Gatorade bath as his intellectual property...
…the guy could be collecting royalties every time a coach gets dunked, and probably earn more than her ever did cumulatively over the span of his career!
by Step up and make big plays on Jan 8, 2010 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
Playoffs?
lets bring in the best human soundbite around’s son. the kids got one hell of a defensive mind. hes even had some mild sucuess running a team. a few more years of being a DC for tommy and he can turn out to be a pretty good coach for us someday
being fair...
that’s his dad that said the “playoffs” soudbite.
Tho..maybe his son comes up with something better…?
N8 !
thats why
i said lets bring in the best human soundbitee around’s son lol sorry for the confusion
by casual observer on Jan 9, 2010 12:33 AM EST up reply actions
Can't we just steal a coordinator from the eagles again?
They have a defense exactly like how I want ours, except better than theirs.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
When there's a WILL there's a WAY
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