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'Kudos & Wet Willies:' Wide receiver edition

If you watched last night's 27-25 loss by our New York Giants to the New York Jets you should be able to guess that today's 'Kudos & Wet Willies' will be dominated by two things.

  1. Discussion of wide receivers, both good and bad.
  2. How easily you can be misled by simply looking at the box score.

So, with that little preamble out of the way let's get to the good stuff. And, since we like good news before bad we will hand out 'Kudos' first.

Star-divide

Kudos to ...
  • Hakeem Nicks: Unquestionably the star of the game for the Giants. Just about the time you thought a Giants' wide receiver was NEVER going to make a play, the No. 1 draft pick showed up. He hauled in fourth-quarter touchdown passes of 22 yards (an amazing diving, left-handed grab in the back of the end zone while well covered), and 71 yards from David Carr. He made four other catches and finished his night with six grabs for 144 yards. Nicks' numbers don't lie -- he had a terrific game.
  • David Carr:  Carr has not had a great pre-season, but he looked solid Saturday night. Twelve-for-21 for 181 yards and two TDs, including an impressive late scoring drive. He also ran for a pair of first downs. Carr, most impressively to me, fought his instincts to bail out of the pocket, stayed in there and made some plays. After that performance I feel better about him.
  • Eli Manning: Look at his numbers (9-for-21, 91 yards, one touchdown, one interception, a 51.9 rating) and you would think I was nuts putting him here. If you watched the game you know better. His day looks a lot different if Steve Smith doesn't drop a 90-yard touchdown pass, and Domenik Hixon hangs on to an easy catch that turned into a game-changing interception. Even Eli's misses were thrown properly, out of the reach of defenders. He threw the ball well. His receivers, though, didn't catch it well.
  • Lawrence Tynes: Made a 38-yard field goal and missed just short from 51. Can't kill him for a miss from tha distance. Tynes gets 'kudos,' primarily for his kickoffs, though. I don't remember any that weren't inside the 5-yard line, and he did get at least one kickoff into the end zone. Hopefully, he can continue that.
  • Danny Ware: This kid is a player. He had nine carries for 43 yards, a lot of that gained on his own, The most impressive thing he did all night was a great fourth-quarter blitz pickup to save Carr from annihilation. Don't know who Ware picked up, but he stopped the guy in his tracks.
  • Ahmad Bradshaw: The guy just looks dangerous. He had eight carries for 47 yards, including a 27-yarder.
  • Mathias Kiwanuka: His sack of Mark Sanchez was a thing of beauty, chasing him down from behind and swallowing him up like a certain No. 56 used to do. Kiwi will have a huge season spelling Osi Umenyiora and Justin Tuck.
  • Jonathan Goff: Five solo tackles for the second-year middle linebacker. That is two impressive games in a row for him.
  • Kevin Dockery: Played well starting at right corner for the injured Aaron Ross. Three tackles for Dockery and two passes defensed.
  • Derek Hagan: Two catches, both on wide receiver screens. Hagan showed the ability to get some yards after catch on both plays, ending up with 25 yards. He also worked hard to get out of bounds on one catch as the Giants were trying to rally for a late score. Finally, Hagan flashed a little of what he has been showing during practice in a real game.
  • Fred Robbins: Four tackles for the big defensive tackle, who looks like he is rounding into form nicely after micro-fracture knee surgery in the off season.
  • The first-team offensive line: Good work by that group, keeping Manning protected and opening some running lanes. Nice to see Rich Seubert and Chris Snee back on the field.

OK, now that we have gone through the good we have to get to the bad. If you watched the game, you know there was plenty of ugly stuff. Let's get to it.

Wet Willies to ...
  • Steve Smith: Steve, I luv ya baby, but you cannot drop perfectly thrown potential 90-yard touchdown passes when you are two steps beyond the defense. Especially not when you have been clamoring for chances to get out of the slot, and be given the opportunity to run some deep routes. Smith has shown great hands for two seasons now, but I saw him drop a couple of deep balls during camp at UAlbany. Steve, if you want the opportunity to run those routes when it counts you have to make those plays.
  • Domenik Hixon: A bad drop on a quick in that turned into an interception deep in Giants' territory and led to a Jets' touchdown. The miscues by the two starting receivers turned what should have been a 14-0 Giants' lead into a 7-7 tie.
  • Mario Manningham: I have said it before, but he has a split personality. Manningham did have four catches for 41 yards, ran some nice routes and made some nice plays. But he dropped a beautiful pass from Carr that hit him right in the numbers and should have been a 30-40-yard gain, and nearly misjudged a punt he had to make an awkward catch. Mario seems to be a 'kwillie,' player -- a thrill-a-minute guy who can keep both teams in the game at the same time.
  • C.C. Brown: Can we please, please, PRETTY PLEASE Uncle Coughlin, find a way to get this guy off the team? For the love of good defense. And my blood pressure! This guy is AWFUL! Sure, he had five tackles. If he had made all the tackles he should have, however, he would have had eight or nine. On top of which, he is clueless in pass coverage. Brown was waaayyy out of position on Mark Sanchez' 31-yard touchdown pass to Chansi Stuckey, leaving him wide open. Then, of course, missing the tackle when he finally did get there. Paging Sha'reef Rashad. Or Vince Anderson. Or anyone else, for that matter.
  • DeAndre Wright: The rookie sixth-round pick got himself all turned around, then fell on the field in a heap on Erik Ainge 70-yard touchdown pass to Aundrae Allison late in the fourth quarter. Probably appropriate, though, since I think Wright's chance to make the team crashed to the ground as soon as he did.
  • Sinorice Moss: I don't remember him doing anything well. I do remember him failing to catch a punt at the 20-yard line that ended up rolling dead at the 1.

-- Jets vs Giants recap

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Couldn't get the game here in the midwest, even

with my FB package. Despite the loss and the misplays by Smith and Hix, I’d say overall the game was very beneficial as a tool for the coaching staff to evaluate players. Love what I read about Nicks and Hagan and the good news about the others. Re the Wet Willies, IMO Brown, Moss, and Wright won’t make the cut. In retrospect, I think we let Moss hang around too long. Mario? Looks like it’ll take another year before we can judge if he’s a keeper. He obviously has a lot to learn and isn’t the brightest bulb in the box. I remain confident the Giants will have a fine season.

by blue gonz on Aug 30, 2009 8:33 AM EDT reply actions  

As do I

Life is good for the Giants. There is a ton of talent, and the receiver situation will work itself out. This is why we loaded up on the defensive front, to take some pressure off the offense.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 8:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

Receivers

The Giants have so many talented, raw receivers that I think that it is likely that somewhere between one or two of them will figure things out by the end of the season. The issue is getting there. I think that what they do at the beginning of the year will not fairly represent what they can expect to be doing once the playoffs roll around.

The issue, I think, is getting to the playoffs.

by sjohnson125 on Aug 30, 2009 9:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

That's what I'm saying

The WR could work itself out, but I don’t think you can say it for sure with confidence.

E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!

by Joe_D on Aug 30, 2009 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

I watched the game yesterday

I can throw in my 2 cents.

Hixon – Good WR, not great. He is not better than DeSean Jackson or even as good which has been argued on here before.

Steve Smith – Same with Hixon. Good, not great.

Manningham – Definitely raw… He COULD step up, but what I’m trying to say is you can’t say that for sure.

Nicks/Barden – Will probably see some plays here and there, will be raw for awhile too.. Could step up but again, who’s to say?

Moss – OK I think you can finally say he sucks. I’ll be damn surprised if he makes the team.

E-A-G-L-E-S EAGLES!!!

by Joe_D on Aug 30, 2009 9:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Pretty good assessment

I think Nicks might be better than you give him credit for. We just have to see how it plays out, but I’m not going to worry about it.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

Joe_D

is all right, except for being an Eagles fan. Generally, at least, I give him credit for coming here and trying to make intelligent, informed arguments. In the end, though, he’s still an Eagles fan.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Joe_D

is an Eagles fan, but he is generally OK. Can’t really consider him a troll, since he is here all the time and he usually tries to make a decent, informed argument. Of course, he is an still an Eagles fan. So, we have to shoot him down — nicely — at every turn!

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think Joe_D

Is a good guy and obviously a football fan..Joe, I think the receiver situation based on last night’s performance has been thrown into a state of flux…We have a couple more weeks to figure it out..We have Vets dropping balls, while rookies are catching them..Not a good thing at this stage. I thought Carr did great hanging in the pocket for a change and bailed only when he saw an opportunity vs the jitters. Bradshaw and Ware are going to be two players to watch out for..they can flat out run to compliment our resident Brahma Bull Jacobs..The defense still needs to gel together.

by Bobbiblue on Aug 30, 2009 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

Well

It’s like DeSean Jackson last year w/you guys … and Maclin this year. There is a lot of young, raw talent and these guys will continue to improve throughout the season. Nicks showed you last night he could be a star — just give him time.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

Joe D, Fred, and Bye Dawk

Are three Eagles fans I highly respect for their ability to look at it from all sides, including the ugly of their own team. They may have a slight bias to their own, but who doesn’t?

by brisulph on Aug 31, 2009 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Id give Jacobs a Kudo too

then again he’s usually just a lock for one isn’t he (when he’s on the field at least)?

Jake is constantly called a one dimensional back, cuz he doesn’t catch the ball. Well, you can’t catch the ball when they don’t throw to you, and Jake caught a TD pass yesterday. I haven’t seen the highlights yet, but that’s a nice step in the right direction.

And I don’t really agree on CC Brown. He’s kinda like the Manningham of the defense. He looks pretty good on a few plays then horrendous on others. OF course, since he’s on the defense and a safety, his bad plays are a lot worse than Mario’s.

He may be blocking the spot of a younger guy liek Rashad or Travonti Johnson, but I kinda think he’ll be solid for the Giants this year (as long as he doesn’t see the field too much!)

GODZZIIIIIRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!

by FreeBradshaw on Aug 30, 2009 8:38 AM EDT reply actions  

Jacobs

True, except he also got a ball ripped right out of his hands by Bart Scott. As for Brown, he seriously makes me miss James Butler — and that is not a good thing. He’s horrible in coverage, and he is iffy as a tackler — and those are not good things to be as a safety.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 8:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oh yea....

the picture at the head of the game recap…..

I didn’t watch the game, so all I see is the game stays (must have overlooked the fumble too….). I guess that about evens everything out so….I guess I rescind my kudo.

The best thing about CC is that he’s a backup, unlike Butler. Hopefully that means he’s not in there all that much.

I never really thought of him as a cut possibility, but I wouldn’t be surprised I guess.

GODZZIIIIIRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!

by FreeBradshaw on Aug 30, 2009 9:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

**stats.

GODZZIIIIIRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!

by FreeBradshaw on Aug 30, 2009 9:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

C.C. Brown

He will see some time on the field if the Giants keep him. He is the third safety, after all. I have my fingers crossed that a better option falls into the Giants lap when teams start releasing players this week.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

Nicks

Did Nicks see any playing time with the first team (didn’t see the game)? If not, then its time. We need someone to make plays.

by potroast on Aug 30, 2009 8:53 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Yes, he did

He played some in the first half and did catch one ball from Eli.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 8:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

If things keep going the way have, pot,

I’ve been thinking Nicks might be first string before the season ends.

by blue gonz on Aug 30, 2009 9:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

That's probably ideal

because it appears right now that Smith’s home should be the slot.

by potroast on Aug 30, 2009 9:06 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

From last night's stats

and performances, sounds like Nicks will be first string by the end of preseason.

by njgiant on Aug 30, 2009 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

I almost put it that way myself, but thought that it

was too far out an idea for a fairly conservative guy like TC. A rookie? AT WR? Personally, my thought is—why not? I might be giddy about his ability given how little we’ve seen of him, yes, given the parameters you cite, he might very well start on opening day. One thing for sure: we’ll be seeing a lot of this rook.

by blue gonz on Aug 30, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rookie or not

I live in Raleigh so I got to see a lot of Nicks and can honestly say “the kid has the skills to pay the bills”.

by njgiant on Aug 31, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

Smith

seems to have a problem with the deep ones – he also dropped a perfectly thrown deep ball in Buffalo two seasons ago, as well as one thrown over the top in Pittsburgh last year (the play where the defender clearly grabbed his jersey as he was running down the middle, but I still think he should have caught it).

by Mount17 on Aug 30, 2009 9:21 AM EDT reply actions  

It's interesting

Smith said he was rarely asked to run the deep route at USC. Same with the Giants his first two years. He can get open, but it is a ball he isn’t used to catching. This is why there is a pre-season.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

It is also interesting that

the scouts didn’t see that he can’t catch a long ball.

by Bobbiblue on Aug 30, 2009 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Watch out Mount

I made this same point about Smith Last night durring the open thread and a lot of posters ripped into me as a fair weather fan w/ little football knowldege. I obviousley agree with you about Smith, I think he’s a very good possesion guy but I’m worried about him going deep and being a fulltime outside WR. We need him to step up to become Eli’s go-to-guy in all situations.

by Landeta on Aug 30, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

I still think Hixon would have caught the long ball in the 2 minute drill

if he hadn’t been dragging another person for 15 yards. The ball glanced off of his fingertips, that could have been a big gain. The deflection (wasn’t really a drop) for the INT was inexcusable, as was Smith’s drops. But I choose to be more encouraged by the fact that Smith got open long at least twice, he will catch more than he drops. Good call on Goff as well Ed, he’s just been making quiet, solid plays. I wondered if anyone else was watching him. Finally, on the Stuckey TD, the missed tackles were a total group effort, but was the blown coverage on Dockery or Brown? Or both? Dockery looked like he let him go for most of the field, but Brown could not have taken a worse angle to the play without running in the opposite direction. What do you think about that play?

Homer: Aw, twenty dollars! I wanted a peanut!
Homer's Brain: Twenty dollars can buy many peanuts!
Homer: Explain how!
Homer's Brain: Money can be exchanged for goods and services!
Homer: Woo-hoo!

by bigbluethruandthru on Aug 30, 2009 9:27 AM EDT reply actions  

Blown coverage

I thought it was Brown, and here’s why. Dockery clearly let him go in a zone scheme, and Brown was running in the end zone with a receiver who was being covered by someone else. It ‘could’ have been Dockery, but much more likely it was Brown. Especially since Dockery should know this defense inside and out as long as he has been a Giant.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

It was definitely brown...

yes Dockery gave him up pretty early…but brown clearly blew the assignment…he was helping out webster down field when Webster had his man blanketed. Clearly a mistake by Brown…and than he followed it up by missing the tackle.

Still you can’t cut Brown…he’s only getting a lot of time b/c philips only played a half. we won’t see brown as much come week 1.

What a great play by webster though to break up that would be TD pass….he didnt’ even watch the ball but yet knew exactly when to put him hand in to get a piece of it.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

Stuckey TD fluke

That was just pisspoor tackling by the Defense and I can guarantee those guys are going to hear it from both the coach and their team. Of course, in typical Jets fashion everyone celebrates like it won them the Super Bowl.

To me, the first string Defense did look a little rusty and made a bunch of lazy penalities. Not surprised since a lot of these guys have been limited this off season, and Osi has seen action in a year. We are also working with a coordinator. I wouldn’t be surprised if we see a bit of a repeat of the opening of 2007 where it takes the D a few games to really catch fire.

by JustinTuckRule on Aug 30, 2009 9:40 AM EDT reply actions  

Eli has had more interceptions that are the receivers fault

then any quarterback i’ve ever seen.. It happened with he who must not be named, it happened with Shockey, rarely with amani.

President of the Ramses Barden Fan Club

Fact on Villanova Sports

by Hoyadestroya85 on Aug 30, 2009 10:29 AM EDT reply actions  

I believe the Giants led the league in drops...

In ‘06, or or ’07…so it’s nothing he’s not used to. Just one more reason you gotta love this guy cause you’ll never hear him complain about it.

“Aww shucks people are gonna drop some passes but you just gotta go out there and keep throwin’ the ball there way.”

"We'll show up tomorrow and do the same thing we try to do every day, Kick Pedroia's ass in cribbage and try and win a baseball game."

by tito (eight and oh) on Aug 31, 2009 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

mostly good

Dockery totally blew that tackle on the 5. What was that? And secondary tackling in general was weak. Missed tackled DO have me swearing at the TV. Overall though I thought we outplayed the baby Giants, a couple of odd turnovers, played without several key players. I’m happy.

and…. NO INJURIES! WOOHOO!

Bring on the regular season. Oh and lets see some nice play frolm Nicks & Barden vs. the Pats!

You play to win the game!

by Simms-McConkey on Aug 30, 2009 10:39 AM EDT reply actions  

If your giving Wet Willies

The person that stood out to me other than the WR(and I am rewatching the game this morning) is Chase Blackburn. He is out of his league. The man has no speed, he has been pancaked 3 times in the first 2 quarters and when he does blitz he gets picked up by TE’s… I understand he is a good special teams player but that is where he needs to stay. If we have to count on his play at the LB position much longer than a half that will hurt !!! Need depth at MLB next year please(or pick up a free agent) because a free agent can’t be much worse.

by LT56 on Aug 30, 2009 11:03 AM EDT reply actions  

What?

He got into the backfield for a nice solo tackle on the RB for a loss, made another nice solo tackle again on the RB that could have been a big gain…he did a good job of tackling keller in pass coverage too, and when he did blitz they got SOME pressure. Forced Sanchez into a few bad quick passes…even the TD pass he was forced out and knocked down…but CC Brown blew the coverage. Sure they may pick up the blitzer but someone will get through.

 The fact of the matter is that he was really the only LB making plays early on. Kehl was primarily tackling blockers and Clark gets taken outta the play the minute someone puts a hand on him. Chase actually made plays last night.

  

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

I agree

Chase made up for his poor performance last Sat, he looked pretty good. Clark was ok too, I wish Kehl would step up a little more, at times he looks so quick and good but other times he’s invisible.

by Landeta on Aug 30, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

DBs

Ed, no idea why you plussed Dockery. Nearly every reception was completed to his guy. Webster and Thomas were like glue all night. CC Brown should get the old yeller treatment after last night, take him out back and shoot him, he’s slow, he can’t tackle, and looked out of place. Agree with you here, Ed, would much rather give the roster spot to a hungry young kid.

Also think it’s odd that you don’t have a problem with our kicker coming up short on a 50 yarder, that’s a makeable distance for most under-40 kickers. Was happy to see his kickoff improvement though.

Not sure Moss should get a willie. He was only on the field a handful of snaps and never had a ball thrown his way that I could tell. seemed like they were focused on getting looks for Mario and Nicks. Barden only had a look or two and Hagan just those two screens (which he did nicely with)

Also would like to give props to coverage teams, which were nice esp. with a threat like Leon, Koets for learning how to snap, Jacobs for learning how to catch. The rook Beatty leaves me hopeful that in a year or two we can move Diehl to RT and give him the LT slot.

by TNYFBG on Aug 30, 2009 11:17 AM EDT reply actions  

Dockery...

i agree with you but he did make a few plays.

thomas > dockery

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

Can I get a 'do-over?'

I’m invoking the ‘Jerry Jones Rule’ for ‘kudos & wet willies.’ I was thinking about a couple of the nice pass deflections Dockery made, but in reviewing the game a lot of balls were completed in his direction. He wasn’t Lito Sheppard, but he wasn’t Darrelle Revis, either.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nicks

Does anybody else think after last night he should playing with the first team. Manningham looks like he’ll make too many mistakes and still is not in sync with Eli and he’s had a full training camp. Smith in 07 and Hixon in 08 did a lot better in their first preasons working with Eli. After a slow start this camp Nicks just looks good all around. I know he’s only about 6-2 but he seems a lot bigger out there. I was just pumed about his performance. Great Endzone catch!

by Landeta on Aug 30, 2009 11:27 AM EDT reply actions  

well technically...

last night he did get reps with the first team which is what we all wanted. He didn’t get a lot of time, but I think it’s fair to say that after last night he’ll be getting more.

pre season can be a blessing and a curse…it hurt our defense but is helping our offense.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

In time .. all in good time

He is moving up the depth chart quickly.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nicks and Barden...

Coming to your highlight film theatre soon!!

by Bobbiblue on Aug 30, 2009 11:35 AM EDT reply actions  

D-Line

Besides the great sack from Kiwi and solid tackling by Big Fred, Goff and Blackburn (aka Gary Reasons on crack) against the run I thought the Jets O-Line clearly won the battle.
 
It always seems as if Tuck is exhausted out there and Osi is getting blocked too easily when plays get stretched out on screens or sweeps.

I hope after all the emphasis that was put on bolstering the D-Line in the offseason that they really step it up and own the trenches, especially early on as the offense finds their groove.

by JINTS14 on Aug 30, 2009 11:46 AM EDT reply actions  

D-Line

I’m a little worried about the D, I know we have talent but they a lot like they did at the end of last year giving up broken plays and lack of consistant rush. Romo & McNabb turn broken plays into big plays, I hope they get it straigtened out by week one.

by Landeta on Aug 30, 2009 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hey Ed...what about Chase?

I thought Chase played much better last night. Don’t have the stats but I saw at least 3 solo tackles in limited time. Much better at defending those short passes, did a nice job tackling Keller a couple of times…even got in the backfield for a stop. I actually saw a very good Giant defense for the first quarter.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 11:46 AM EDT reply actions  

Limited time??

I’m not sure what you watched last night but he played through the 3rd qtr. so limited time doesn’t get taken into account. I have it on DVR and I just watched the entire 1st and 2nd qtr. again he can’t run… He gets blocked everytime and his side to side speed is ..well not there. All the peps saying he played good today.. so 2-3 qtrs of the preseason he has done good..What??? If we need to depend on him for any length of time we are in trouble is all I’m saying. He does show a flash here or there but not enough in my opinion.

by LT56 on Aug 30, 2009 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

well from what I saw...

he had 3-4 solo tackles and solid plays in 2 quarters…that’s what I call limited time. It’s funny you single out Chase when we really never saw any plays made from Kehl and Clark. You say he shows a “flash” here or there…what exactly is a “flash”? If a flash means he made a play than those “flashes” are good things…and how do you rate Kehl and Clark’s performance….they must be horrible?

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

What I'm saying

is this… He had 6 tackles last night(3 solo tackles) according to the stas….not bad most would say right!! BUT if he makes 3,4,5,6,7 tackles up the middle then can’t get on his horse to help on a tackle on a sweep or bubble screen something like that(an outside play) then he his limited(If they score once or twice on an outside play I would run the ball up the middle killing the clock and the middle LB will get 3,4,5,6 tackles)…which means the DB’s have to come off coverage earlier and then before you know it long ball down the field because others are helping the LB’s because of lack of speed. As for Kehl and Clark your right they aren’t in my opinion someone you want on the field for a long period of time(I can give Kehl a little break) just because he is young and not been in game situations as much as Clark and Chase. I’m mainly saying we need LB help in coming years(which we all know and have been saying for years now) depth etc.. and if Pierce goes down we may be in trouble with the depth we have now that’s it…

by LT56 on Aug 30, 2009 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Let me ask you this

I know we are playing young guys a lot, but do feel like the Def. has that aggresiveness they have had the last couple of years and if so..Is it because it’s only preseason and playing young guys or maybe Sheridan getting use to calling plays which could be of some concern no…

by LT56 on Aug 30, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok...point taken...

at the same time…on some of those bubble screens a CB or an outside LB gotta step up and blow one of them blockers up. I actually did see Chase show nice range on one takcle on a toss to i believe jones, maybe washington…he came across the field and made a nice tackle.

I think sheridan is suffering from tuck not being 100% when healthy he demands a double team…I’m actually really concerned about those bone spurrs…but to sheridan’s credit when he did bring the blitz they got through…not a lot of sacks but they did get pressure.

they must disguise the blitz too chicago picked up on it and so did the jets…that’s why they had success on some of those screens too…because they showed blitz and they made adjustments.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

you could say the same thing about AP

both AP and Chase are not the most physically gifted players, but find a way to make plays

by queler on Aug 30, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Was anyone at the game?

I heard Tuck was pointing at his foot, changing his shoes, and even shaking his head at the trainers when he came off the field???

are the spurrs giving him problems already???

When healthy Tuck demands a double team that will free up everyone else. But if he can’t get that push…well, it’s a big problem for this defense.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 12:11 PM EDT reply actions  

I thought he had surgery

on the bone spurns in the offseason?

by Landeta on Aug 30, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

no he didn't...

he didn’t want to get it done, said he was looking into non surgical ways of dealing with them.

This is really the one guy we need on defense.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

I want to give one wet willie to Kevin Gilbride...

on the reverse to Nicks…i know you want to get your rookie involved in the game but that play should have gone to Hixon. Silly play call.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 12:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Remember, it's pre-season

You give the ball to the guy because you want to find out how he will handle it … so that you know whether or not it would be a good idea to give him that play during a game that mattered. You already know Hixon can run it.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

you are right...

I guess i had flash backs of the manningham reverse…might as well do it now and instead of in a real game. good point Ed.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I had them, too

To be honest, it’s not a play I like. But, you try things sometimes to see how players handle them.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

I saw more bad than good things last night ...

Carr still worries me – he just freezes up mentally when the rush is on, and holds on for the sack.

CC Brown was just awful – crossing my fingers that we find a way to cut him.

D-line wasn’t very dominant, and we had better prepare to see a lot of screens like the ones the Jets ran quite successfully.

If you’re going to throw a fade for a 2-point conversion … shouldn’t it be to Barden ? Just asking.

The 2 big plusses – no big injuries, and we still have a 3-headed beast at RB !

by Shofner85 on Aug 30, 2009 2:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Geez, Shof

It’s still pre-season. The Giants are still trying to find out about a guy like Hagan. In a regular season game I would not want that play to go to Hagan, but in pre-season, why not?

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, I agree ...

Pre-season is about finding out about the non-starters as much as anything. But still, I don’t think we can just assume Barden can do it at this level. I just would have like to see if he could use that body to not be pushed so wide running the fade like Hagan was. Don’t want to find that out against the Skins.

by Shofner85 on Aug 30, 2009 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sure

I guess there are only so many positions and so many plays. Can’t find out about everybody at the same time. Barden’s time will come.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

the good news is that Brown won't be on the field as much w/ philips being that starter...

also, i thought carr had a much better showing…not to mention eli is very durable.

I agree the fade to Hagan was a bad throw but not necessarily the wrong guy….hagan has great leaping ability but carr didn’t put enough air on it…hagan even signaled ater teh pass that he wanted it to be a jump ball.

by andiamo708 on Aug 30, 2009 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

so is Moss going to get cut?

how long is this team willing to wait for this guy to figure it out?

by SBakerTheTouchdownMaker on Aug 30, 2009 7:51 PM EDT reply actions  

It's possible

If Hagan has moved ahead of Moss, then Moss has no place on the team.

by Ed Valentine on Aug 30, 2009 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Hagan is in and Moss is out

Interesting comment you made Ed, concerning Moss never being asked to go deep in College..I am surprised that the scouting team didn’t pick that up..Maybe they thought he could learn and maybe they thought he could be a short yardage receiver with speed and ability to gain yards after the catch..I don’t know.

by Bobbiblue on Aug 31, 2009 4:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

agree to a point

eli had a really good game some off the best i have seen him thow(i know you gave him a kudo but gotta give him some props) , manningham also had 2 penalties drawn by the defender covering him thats his speed and his quick break as for the punt even megget did that his first couple of times he started on punt return ( the third went for a td) so giving him a willie is iffy to me but otherwise right on withe the Kand WW

by lou b on Aug 31, 2009 12:37 PM EDT reply actions  

Usage of Barden

Ok, tell me if anyone was sharing a brain with me on this one. On the second oppty for the two point conversion, Barden was on the field, and this was the prime chance to throw a lob to the corner and let our big guy go up and get it. Instead I believe we ran a Danny Ware run up the middle that was short about a yard and a half. That was THE perfect chance to see if this kid can be a red zone threat. Wasted opportunity if you ask me.

by wilddre22 on Aug 31, 2009 5:36 PM EDT reply actions  

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