Second round has been good to the Giants
by Ed Valentine on Mar 11, 2009 7:00 AM EDT
in News
39 comments
When it comes to the NFL Draft it seems that all anyone pays attention to leading up to the big event is who his or her favorite team will select in the first round.
In reality, of course, there is a lot more to a successful or failed draft than whatever player your team selects in the first round.
We discussed first-round flops selected by our New York Giants on Monday. Today, let's look at some of the best second-round selections the team has made since 1970. As we go through it, you'll see that it's a who's who of some of the greatest players in modern Giants history.
Here's the list.
- Brad Van Pelt (1973)
- Joe Morris (1982)
- Leonard Marshall (1983)
- Jumbo Elliott (1988)
- Michael Strahan (1993)
- Amani Toomer (1996)
- Tiki Barber (1997)
- Osi Umenyiora (2003)
- Chris Snee (2004)
There were several other quality players taken in the second round. What I call the second tier of players taken in that round would include these names:
Earnest Gray, Mark Collins, Phillippi Sparks, Corey Webster, Steve Smith.
So you can see that there are still plenty of future stars on the board once the first round is over. Finding them is a key to success.
[UPDATE: So, the second round has been better to the Giants than I even thought, initially. I missed a couple of players when I put this together. Pepper Johnson (1986) and Jason Sehorn (1994) should also have been included, at least in the second tier.]
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With Strahan on the list,
how can you vote for anyone else?
by blue gonz on Mar 11, 2009 7:40 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
It is possibly a case of where the poll should have been ‘other than Michael Strahan.’ It is amazing, though, how many terrific players are on this list.
by Ed Valentine on Mar 11, 2009 7:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It might be better
than the #1 list? Of course, LT’ll be on that one.
by blue gonz on Mar 11, 2009 7:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Mark Collins
Was always an unsung hero to me. He played on two championship defenses, and was a pretty damn good corner.
Giants fan from the womb to the tomb
by Jim Schmiedeberg on Mar 11, 2009 8:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The forgotten man
You’re right. Collins was one of those corners who was so good, QBs very seldom threw in his direction. Consequently he never generated any stats. He just quietly shut down the other teams best receivers game after game and hardly anybody ever noticed him.
by Tucker Fredrickson on Mar 11, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, got to go with Strahan on this one.
While we should get a couple of HOFamers from this group, Strahan is the only one to get in on the first ballot, no questions asked. Thanks to Phillippi for giving us Jordan. She’s actually putting out some decent music.
by njgiant on Mar 11, 2009 8:55 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
WOW
That’s almost one half of a pro bowl team.
by John W on Mar 11, 2009 10:08 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
mark collins
I second the remarks about Mark Collins. I recall a few special games where Collins absolutely shut down Jerry Rice. Strahan is clearly the top man but I have some fond memories of the some of the other second rounder. I rememember in a playoff game against the Rams (1985 perhaps) Marshall making a huge stop in a short yardage situation and Morris making a 40 yard run that broke open the game. And those were the days when Giant playoff victories were so rare that they took on the status of miracles. I also remember Morris running wild the next year in a Monday night game against the Skins and in the playoffs against the Niners. That was the Giant’s 1st Superbowl year. But the run that I remember the most fondly is one he made against the Niners in the regular season. The Giant’s season was on the line because they were playing the Skins in DC the next week. The Giants were down 17-0 at halftime and were rallying in the second half. A turning point game was a short yardage situation; the Niners had loaded the line the entire game and had stoped Morris cold. But with the game on the line, Simms handed off to Morris and he got the first down. They don’t get much bigger than that.
by tdaddesio on Mar 11, 2009 12:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
how about
Marshall laying the wood on Montana..
It's not easy being Giants fan in Philly.. but it sure is satisfying
http://novafacts.blogspot.com
by Hoyadestroya85 on Mar 11, 2009 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was harder than LT's hit
on Theissmann. Of course, Joe never came back. Somehow Montana did.
by blue gonz on Mar 11, 2009 3:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Wow
Strahan with 81% of the vote. I wonder, if Tiki didn’t stab the team in the back and/or if Strahan had retired before the SB season if this would be a much closer vote. I love Strahan (and voted for him), but Tiki is the best offensive player in team history.
by cjmulrain on Mar 11, 2009 3:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Tiki
I am a little surprised he hasn’t drawn more votes. There are bitter feelings toward him, though, because of the way things ended. I am sure that has a lot to do with it.
by Ed Valentine on Mar 11, 2009 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's the problem...Tiki was too offensive...LOL
Strahan has to be #1. But Joe Morris has to have a special place in our hearts. He literally beat the Redskins single handedly in a must win game, even making a long run with only one shoe.
by giant fan since 57 on Mar 11, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It sounds hard to believe, but
if I had to choose between Tiki and Joe, Id take Joe. I’d take Hampton over him , too. I don’t care what the stats say’. Hell, I’d take Choo-Choo Roberts or Giff. The giants didn’t win (couldn’t) win until Tiki was gone.
by blue gonz on Mar 11, 2009 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
they did go to a Super Bowl with him
and the loss was on Collins’ shoulders (well, arm), not Tiki’s. Tiki pretty much single-handedly carried the team into the playoffs in 2006, and would have been the MVP in 2005 if it weren’t for Shawn Alexander’s ridiculous 27 TD’s. The majority of Tiki’s career with the Giants they didn’t have a great defense or a great O-line, and his best seasons were wasted on a QB transition. I don’t know if they would have won Super Bowl XLII w/o him, b/c I think a big part of that run was fueled by the doubt caused when he retired and the way that allowed the locker room to gel. That said, I think if you dropped him into the middle of the 1986 or 1990 seasons, the Giants don’t get worse and probably get even better – those locker rooms could have handled his ego (hell, they handled LT’s), and he would have instantly become the most talented offensive player. Maybe the ’86 Giants go 15-1 with Tiki.
by cjmulrain on Mar 12, 2009 7:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nicely argued, cj.
I’ll let you and NJ Giant hash out the O line strength.
by blue gonz on Mar 12, 2009 7:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Better than YA?
Simms? Best RB? Okay, he’s got the stats, but….
by blue gonz on Mar 11, 2009 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I love Tiki but
I think Strahan gets the edge because of a couple of reasons. 5 more years of service and in transition (from the field to the desk), he has not made negative remarks against former teammates. He has a Superbowl ring and still holds the single season sack record. Tiki put up some awesome numbers if you look at the stats but I think that his early fumble problems and that crack on Eli’s locker room leadership comes into play. Also, he was only a starter for half of his career. If he had started his whole career and didn’t have the early fumble problems, he would have definite HOF numbers, plus that ring thing comes back to play . IMO this is why Strahan runs away from Tiki.
by njgiant on Mar 11, 2009 4:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Not being a starter helped him.
As he aged, he got better (i.e., smarter) plus his superman trining program made him a lot stronger. Had he been a starter, he probably wouldn’t have lasted so long.
by blue gonz on Mar 11, 2009 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tiki bulked up so much from that "superman" training I'm surprised no one ever suggested he was enhanced.
I’m not saying he was, mind you.
by giant fan since 57 on Mar 12, 2009 5:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Speaking of the Draft
I am doing a two round mock draft, on arrowheadpride.com, which a different Chiefs’ fan is picking for a different team. I am selecting for the New York Giants. Being that I do not follow the Giants all that well; I was wondering if you Giants’ fans who post on here can help me out. Let me know what you think the Giants will do with the 29th pick. In this Mock Draft, the pick is untradeable, I think, so I will not be able to trade the pick. I will be making the selection on Thursday, April 2nd, in the afternoon, or the evening, so there is a lot of time between now and then that you can voice your point of views.
Thanks.
Here is the mock draft if you are interested.
http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2009/3/10/788310/ap-mock-draft-rules-round
by ChiefsFan90s on Mar 11, 2009 4:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Corey Webster...
… will be on this list in a few years.
He’s already a borderline top 5 CB in the league.
But this is Strahan and it’s not really close.
I would have him followed by Van Pelt and then Osi.
by Jonathan. on Mar 11, 2009 5:44 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Webster
maybe should be in the second tier already.
by Ed Valentine on Mar 11, 2009 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I was gonna say, how was he left off?
what a pick that turned out to be, especially since he looked pretty bad prior to the Title season
Okay, just so I understand it... in your wildest fantasy, you are in hell. And you are co-running a bed and breakfast with the devil.
by bren on Mar 11, 2009 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd make Van Pelt # 2 as well.
Osi? Too soon to tell. When he retires, he might beat out Stray.
by blue gonz on Mar 11, 2009 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's one bet I wouldn't take.
Actually, at this moment I think Osi is slightly overrated by Giants fans. Tuck could wind up being the better player.
by blue gonz on Mar 12, 2009 8:54 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Osi
George, I think you know how I feel about Osi. He is not Strahan. He has never been the No. 1 guy on the line who commands and defeats double teams. He has some great games, and makes some great plays. But, Stray was better. So is Tuck. Osi has way too many games where he completely disappears. That said, I will be very happy to have him back next season.
by Ed Valentine on Mar 12, 2009 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Da Bulls
I think it’s safe to say that Osi is our Pippen while Strahan was and Tuck has a chance to be our Jordan. That being said, would rather have him than not and I think with all of the upgrades to the line, he has a chance for a monster season.
by njgiant on Mar 12, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
COME ON!!?? What's a $1000 gonna be worth in 2018?? (a tank of gas?)
I’d go with you that Tuck probably ends up with more pro-bowls then Osi. Tuck has a mean streak; Osi seems more mellow. Still very good, but I really think that 6 sack Philly game built him up a little too much. Hope I’m wrong…
by NY17NE14 on Mar 12, 2009 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He'll have a good year
You’re right. The Philly game accounted for half of his sacks that year. I’m looking for 15 plus from him this year. I think with the success of Tuck and the new additions to the line, he’s going to hit the field with something to prove.
by njgiant on Mar 12, 2009 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What are you figuring, 7 1/2 sacks in each of Philly games; plus 14 more games...
:-)
I agree that the way the defense sits now, everybody is going to get a handful of sacks!!!!
by NY17NE14 on Mar 12, 2009 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Great Thread!
I’ve noticed this trend since I’ve been a G-Man fan. I always look forward to the second round. Agree with the above posters. Mark Collins is a very underrated player. In 1990 he completely shut Jerry Rice down in 7-3 Regular season loss and in the Championship Game victory and layed the wood to Andre Reed a couple times in the SB. I agree Strahan best second round pick and the Giants did not have a first round pick that year because they picked uuuhhh Dave Brown in the 92 supplemental Draft.
by Landeta on Mar 12, 2009 9:37 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
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