Justin Tuck: Soft? Me, soft?
by Ed Valentine on Dec 4, 2009 12:00 PM EST
in News
62 comments
New York Giants defensive coordinator Bill Sheridan is not a rah-rah motivator, that much has always been obvious. But, if Sheridan's comments Thursday that his defense has not been physical enough were intended to get under the skin of some players, mission accomplished.
Defensive end Justin Tuck is not too happy with Sheridan's assessment.
"I disagree," Tuck said when told about Sheridan's comments. "Everybody has an opinion. Maybe I'm completely wrong by saying I disagree. But in my opinion I don't think that is the case.
"Go ask the O-lines and the offensive tackles or the guards that I play against," Tuck continued. "I don't mean to make this an individual thing. I don't think (Sheridan) said I was unphysical but when you talk about the team, I am part of the team, so I take it personally. So go ask some of the people I play against and ask the how physical I am. If they come back and tell you I'm not, then maybe I'm just a guy that blows smoke all day because I don't know about myself."
My take: Good. Tuck is ticked, and I hope a bunch of the other defenders are, too. Defensive players never, ever want to be accused of being soft. Maybe they will do something about it. Which, I'm thinking, is exactly what Sheridan wants.
By the way, Tuck did a very entertaining interview with 103.3 FM ESPN Dallas-Fort Worth Thursday. Give it a listen if you have five minutes to kill.
The Dallas Morning News today has a story about how the Cowboys feel they have benefitted, both financially and on the field, from replacing Chris Canty with Igor Olshansky.
That part of the story wasn't what really caught my attention, though. Here is what did. Remember how we were killing Sheridan the other day for dropping Canty into coverage. Turns out this is something Wade Phillips asked him to do frequently last season, and that he did well. He had five -- yes, five -- passes defended for Dallas last season.
Some of you old-timers will appreciate this Q&A with legendary Giant Frank Gifford.
(E-mail Ed at bigblueview@gmail.com)
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I disagree with Tuck!
While maybe he’s being “physical”…you can’t tell me that pussified effort on Thursday was not a soft effort. As a whole…no, Sheridan is right.
Both sides of the ball were getting blown off the ball. And when they did move their man…they didn’t make a play.
I hope Tuck and the rest of the D-line are pissed. USE IT!
"It ain't over till its over"---
to me this is bad news
I’ve been saying for weeks that the problem is a disconnect and lack of respect between the unit and the coordinator. From the preseason Osi blowup, to Antonio deciding where Sheridan would be allowed to call the game from, to this silly sniping, it shows the unit has no respect for their leader. They aren’t playing well or playing hard because they’re not motivated to succeed for/by this man. Coughlin undermined Sheridan with the sideline thing and I think the unit has suffered this season as a result.
You play to win the game!
Gifford
Thanks Ed. Gifford’s Q & A brought back some old memories. I recall listening to the greatest game ever played with my Dad. I was just a young’un but remember how mad Dad got at Gifford for fumbling….at least I think he fumbled a time or two. Thanks for the memories.
+1
Always good to hear from one of the all-time Giants greats. Most still believe JB was the greatest RB ever. IMO, Barry Sanders beats him by a nose.
My most vivid memories of JB weren't all those times
he went head-to-head with Sam huff, but his fantastic game in the Cotton Bowl against TCU,( an all-white team if memory serves correctly.) JB was a marked man, but carried Syracuse on his back, reurning kicks and kicking extra points as well as tearing off big yards as an RB. Tight game, but TCU squeaked out a win.
I'm reading up on these guys
and no wonder the giants were good in the 50’s.
Tom Landry: Defensive coordinator.
Vince Lombardi: Assistant coach
Couldn’t we of kept one of these guys?
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
Mara let Lombardi, (one of the Seven Blocks of Granite and a college friend)
go to GB, thinking he could get him back whenever he wanted. L refused to abandon GB.You could hold a coach to his contract then, or at least people thought so until George Allen sued Halas to get out of his Bears contract to go to LA. Landry went to his home state to coach the’boys. They picked another assistant, Allie Sherman (OC or QB coach), who made Mara trade for YA and Shofner and looked like a genius for a few years until he traded away the D line first Modzelewski, then Grier, finally MLB Huff, Robustelli retired. It was all downhill from there, the beginning of the Wilderness Years. That was some coaching staff, two HOFers and HC Jim Lee Howell, no slouch he. Allie had his guru days as well.
Hey Blue
I was not around then but as a big Giant fan I love hearing about the history of my favorite team. I’ve heard that on those 1950’s Giants teams Jim Lee Howell didn’nt do much of anything it was mostly Lombardi and Landry running the team, was that true? Were Giant fans really upset about Ali Sherman taking over? My father seems to hate him he blames the demise of the Giants on him.
1.Landry was a WWII bomber pilot who came
to the Giants as a player from the NY Yankkes when the AAFL merged with the NFL and most of the AAFL teams were absorbed into the older league. The Giants also got Arnie Weinmeister (probably the best tackle the team ever had ansd a super super star in his day) from the Yanks. Howell recognized Landry’s genius and made him a player/coach, later D coordinator.
2. Lombardi started as coach of St. Cecilia’s HS in Englewood NJ and turned it into a powerhouse. Ffrom there he went to West Point and became a disciple of legendary Army Coach Colonel Earl “Red” Blake who invented the flanker, a position he dubbed, “the Lonely End”. Mara, with Howells’ assent, recruited Lombardi to coach the Giants as Offensive Coordinator.
Howell, an ex Giants player was a laid back, well-loved guy with a commanding presence, who acted more as a CEO or COB. He deserves crdit for recognizing and nurturing the coaching talent on his staff.
3. Fans weren’t upset when Allie took over from Howell as far as I can recall. Lombardi and Landry were already gone I think (Lombardi was for sure.) Anyway, Allie a native Brooklynite and former QB (from NYU?) and later the Steagles (Pitsburgh and Philly were combined into one team during WWII) was idolized by Giants fans in his first few years, having traded for YA and Shofner and turning the Giants into the highest scoring offensive machine in the league. I think he was the first coach to have his own TV show. YA retired, Robustelli retired. Shofner might have as well. Aliie started trading away defensive talent to bring the O back to where it was, enraging the fans, particularly when he traded Huff to the Redskins for Dickie James, a tough little RB who could really bust but by no means a top shelf player. In his last years, the fans did hate Allie, booed him unmercifully and forced his firing. I wrote a history of the championship games from those years for Ed a few years back and you can probably find the series in the archives. Ed ran it again a year or so ago. It’s not wonderful but it does summarize the high points of those glorious times before the Wilderness Years.
Other stars retired as well, guys like Giff and Rote,
leaving the giants with the shell of an O.
Makes you wonder what could have been
I like learning the history of the giants. The only problem is, I can’t find lots of stuff on it. Have you found any site that had good pictures and maybe even videos?
Youtube is amazing, but doesn’t have much in the way of old football.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
There're are some good books you can probably get used through
Abe and Amazon, or just try googling names. Anway, my reminsicing has brought to mind my favorite all time wacko Giants Joe Don Looney, who got traded out of his first training camp(a #i pick) after Sherman told him to tape his ankles and Joe replied, “Who knows my ankles better, you or me coach?”
He was hailed as the next coming of JB, but never did much but drive coaches crazy with his eccentricities. He lasted quite a while in the NFL because so many coaches thought they could bring out all the potential he had. Here are some quotes about/by him:
He never had both shoelaces tied. (Sam Huff.)
He had curtains in his mind.
You can’t speak to the ocean to a frog inside a whale. He spent his life inside a whale.
See that glass of water? How do I know that’s not God?
It’s not what you think of me that counts. It’s what I think of you.
The only value of football is fun. When you play for money, it loses its value.
If the end zone is where happiness is, I’d be living there.
And another failed Giants 1st round draft pick...
I looked him up on wiki, and he’s insane.
His last season he had 3 rushes for -3 yards, what a way to end your career.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
There's an article in SI, I think, that you can get on him by googling.
Absolutely fascinating. He might have been #1 overall, I’m not sure. He was way up there. The Giants have made more RB # 1 picks than at any other position, I beleive, and most of them didn’t work out.
Wiki said he 12th overall in the NFL
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Don_Looney
and a pesky AFL team drafted him in the 6th round.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
There is an NFL Films DVD
TItled History of the New York Football Giants. If you look there is a ton of stuff. Hell you can go to Wikepedia and it will discuss some of it.
interesting
maybe I’ll ask for it for christmas.
I’ve gone on wiki and read the giants article like 5 times, but I really want to see some old fashioned football on video.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
This is true:
That part of the story wasn’t what really caught my attention, though. Here is what did. Remember how we were killing Sheridan the other day for dropping Canty into coverage. Turns out this is something Wade Phillips asked him to do frequently last season, and that he did well. He had five — yes, five — passes defended for Dallas last season.
Wade used to do that with each of his 3 down lineman (Canty, Ratliff and Spears), from time to time he would drop one of them into coverage and shooting an ILB and OLB in the vacant place. Canty and Ratliff had a few good plays out of it, Spears not so much and that’s why he didn more often with Ratliff (our NT has wheels…) and some with Canty.
Viva México! Go Cowboys!
Coach Cupcake & BS
Okay Wade is a mediocre head coach but nobody can say that he is not a very good Defensive Coordinator. BS is a poor Defensive Coordinator so just cause Wade did it does not mean Sheridan should.
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
the difference is....
Dallas blitzed guys like Anthony Spencer, Bradie James, Demarcus Ware..etc.
..i.e… a whole bunch of defensive ends who know how to at least hit the QB or sack the QB.
The Giants are “blitzing’” the likes of Robbins, Antonio Pierce, Chase Blackburn…..
…so yea, its not like Sheridan is making a unheard of decision…he’s just not using his personel correctly.
If the Giants had 4-5 pass rushers out there and they were getting to teh QB…then dropping Canty would makes sense.
"It ain't over till its over"---
Interesting, not just the use of Canty to cover, but
that you attribute the ploy to Philips. There’s no denying he’s always been an innovative and successful OC. I lived up near Buffalowhen he was HC, and he was terrible. I share the opinion of the overwhelming majority of Bills fans that his biggest blunder was removing Flutie as QB just before the Music City Miracle Game with the Titans. Flutie played like an HOFer with the Bills and the fans adored him (Kellog’s even produced a cereal, Flutie Flakes, to take advantage of his popularity.)
The Flutie thing right!
I never understood that, he repalced Flutie for Rob Johnson, WTF!!! I loved Flutie he was small but good and fiesty and played well but got benched for a playoff game for no apperent reason for a loser QB.
Flutie had to fight against ignorance and prejudice about his size his whole career.
The man was a magician on fakes to RBs and was so slippery in the pocket he always found a lane to throw. He tore the CFL up. I found it ironic to hear Ditka praise him to the skies as a commentator but wad seemingly blind to his abilities earlier when he coached him.
I found it ironic to hear Ditka praise him to the skies as a commentator
This is the same Coach Ditka that traded all his draft picks for Ricky Williams and your suprised he was blind to Fluties ablilties
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 4:38 PM EST up reply actions
Desperation
I think BS just threw his own hail mary. if it works great but i suspect he sees the writting on the wall, his defense has sucked and needs something to try and motivate these guys otherwise he knows he is done. i’m not so sure it will work.
He had nothing to lose
either way he’s out of a job. The only way to save his job is call out his players and hope they respond.
Tuck needs to keep his mouth closed
Hes been close to invisible out there…..1.5 sacks against Washington , 2 sacks against the Raiders has been all hes done out there…… Doesn’t matter if hes been hurt or not if he can’t be effective he shouldn’t be out there!
by mclaren_is_the_best on Dec 4, 2009 3:06 PM EST reply actions
?
Who in place of him then?
Kiwanuka would be the logical choice…but he doesn’t play on the Giants anymore.
"It ain't over till its over"---
Kiwanuka doesn't play on the giants?
what
by mclaren_is_the_best on Dec 4, 2009 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
I saw Kiwi on a Milk carton last week before the denver game.
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 4:16 PM EST up reply actions
I agree Kiwanuka has been a dissapointment
He was matched up against a TE on the 1hand Marshall catch Thursday night and still couldn’t get to the QB in time BUT Tuck has been just as ineffective on passing downs
by mclaren_is_the_best on Dec 4, 2009 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not saying anything about Tuck
You can’t expect him to be the same Tuck…and Osi while coming off the injury is pretty much the Giants best pass rusher right now.
But didn’t we all think Kiwi was breaking out this year?
I’ve barely noticed he’s out there.
"It ain't over till its over"---
Bill Stupid put him at DT a lot though
Tucks injury probably screwed us more than KP21 if you think about it. Because Tuck can’t go at DT and Kiwi at DE they do the opposite and it just doesn’t work…. Kiwi probably has had less than 100 snaps at DE this year but Yes when he was out there he hasn’t looked like a premier 1st round DE
by mclaren_is_the_best on Dec 4, 2009 6:08 PM EST up reply actions
He has to play because, even with an injury that takes away a huge part of his game,
he’s the best we’ve got.
The problem is sheridan.
ill ive been hearing is “oh the giants dont have strahan anymore thats why they cant get anything done.” from family and friends. They forget he wasnt there last season either and then again neither was osi. The true problem with the giants right now is the defensive coordinator. When we had spags we were unstoppable on defence. now we have dropped so low on the rankings its almost a disgrace to the top 4 status we had last year. If this inspires the team to beat dallas this week then he can win my heart back. as of now i blame him
The g-men gotta get the defence up and force Romo into his decemer slump if we want to do anything towards making the playoffs. Time to get hot and win every game from now on.
Agree, I think most on the board have come around to the same conclusion
There are a lot of posters on here with a huge amount of football and Giant knowledge and I think most don’t like to dump on the coaches. Plus deep down even Sheridan’s critics on the board (that would be me!!) would love to see him turn it around and save the season.
Untill the fat lady sings I will remain hopefull that Sheridan is acutally a good D coordinator and I am just another idiot fan who does not know what he is talking about.
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
We can blame Sheridan
but the players gotta make the plays. The players haven’t done it. F*ck the defensive play calls, the scheme or lack of motivation. When Osi gets run over 31 times in a game and makes ZERO tackles he can’t blame BS. That’s on him and only him. Same holds true with every one on defense.
Here's where we can blame Sheridan
After a performance like that, we are still wondering if Osi is benched or not. (Think Coach Ryan waffaled about benching Kerry Rhodes on the Jets?) So if Osi plays a ton on Sunday after that kind of performance what’s that tell you about the man who is supposed to be in charge of the Defense?
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 4:42 PM EST up reply actions
yeah but
you’re comparing Coach Ryan, the head coach to Coach Sheridan, the DC.
Yeah but but....
Coach Ryan runs the Jet’s Defense, my point is Sheridan needs to take charge if guys are playing bad put them on the bench and find someone who wants to play. Sheridan has for the most part just gone with the same guys no matter what.
Look at our linebackers We are carrying 9 freaking linebackers on the 53 and yet Danny Clark plays no matter how many times he gets pushed around out there. I mean the guy looks like he is on roller skates out there for christ sake. Yet Sheridan won’t give any of the young guys a chance to take over.
I agree the players have played bad but when I watch the D and listen to the players and Sheridan speak to the media it just seems to me he has lost his troops and they don’t play hard for him, and if they keep messing up there are no consequences.
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 5:40 PM EST up reply actions
disagree..
Sheridan sure is not helping things…but its not like the defense at the end of last year was all that great.
We won against Carolina…but the run defense was a sieve there too.
This is more of a player problem than a Bill Sheridan problem.
"It ain't over till its over"---
**and the defense at the end last year of course had Spagnuolo
so that’s why it was a little better.
"It ain't over till its over"---
Free I got to disaree with you on this one.
Let’s look at what happened at the end of the season when we had a REAL Defensive Coordinator We lost to Philly 20-14 Lost to Dallas 20-8 Beat Carolina 34-28 Lost to Minny 20-19 ( we technically won this game because TC took out all the starters) Than lost in the playoffs to Philly 23-11
In the late season losses our Offense averaged 13 points per game. The defense gave up an avg. of 20.5 points per game. I would say we lost more because the Offense could not adjust to how defenses played them after we lost Plax. You are not winning many games averageing 13 points a game in the NFL
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 5:48 PM EST up reply actions
I agree the offense was a lot worse during that time.
Still, in that Philly and Dallas game go check at the yards they gave up.
Brian Westbrook torched them in that game, on the ground and through the air. Dallas had a few big plays on the ground and more than a few screen passes that killed them.
They got killed on the ground against Carolina (remember those 4 TD’s?).
Only in that Phily playoff game did the D really come together again.
I did say the D was better and that was cuz of Spags, but much of the same problems that are killing them now (and CC Brown’s incompetence also hurts) were starting to kill them last year too.
The middle of the Giants D needs to come to work. That’s what they need and I don’t know if they will.
"It ain't over till its over"---
I hear you Free
We were definitly not trending North on D at the end of last year and have continued the same pattern this year. We are both in agreement the players have been terrible this year.
But hear is my point on why I think Sheridan does not know what he is doing. How many players have been benched this year? How misreads does CC get to make before he is not active for a game? When is the last game Sheridan actually suprised an offense with a bold scheme and game plan? Shereidan’s failing are rising way above just shemes he has no control of the players and they don’t play hard for him.
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 6:09 PM EST up reply actions
The bottom line
I’m not a fan of BS however, the players are pros and they are paid a healthy sum of money. Go out and play the f*cking game. Play hard. It sounds like feeble excuses by Tuck et al. Almost every player on D has been underachieving. They need to take a long hard look in the mirror and ask themselves. “Am I playing hard”.
Lots of truth
The D of both Colts with Sanders and Steelers with Troy P fall off a notch when their safeties are out.
yup.
safeties like Polamalu and even KP mask a lot what’s wrong with the defense. Either that, or they just open up a point of attack for the other team…i.e CC Brown.
"It ain't over till its over"---
At this point
If we had Butler back we would be in much better shape. KP showed us potential but has yet ( i got my fingers crossed he makes it back all the way) to prove he is a game changer in the Sanders Polamalu mold.
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 5:53 PM EST up reply actions
Um Frank
The Colts have yet to loose a game so I would say they have adjusted. Granted they would be better with Sanders but they have yet to cost the Colts a loss.
by Late for Dinner on Dec 4, 2009 5:52 PM EST up reply actions
If you meet tuck in person
youd think hes soft too. The guys is SO NICE. On the field, he is our best defender, but the guy is always playing hurt and taking double teams. I dont think you can call a player like that soft.
That dallas guy is really short sighted
This is the first year he’s ever missed a game of football of any kind.
Yeah he’s been hurt this year, but to call him injury plagued for one year is stupid.
Never assume skill at bouncing a ball makes you smarter than the guy who built the court.
Hopefully he can have a breakout game as a 4-3 tackle this week
That will show them ’boys
by mclaren_is_the_best on Dec 4, 2009 7:31 PM EST up reply actions
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