New York Giants notes: Hating the Dallas Cowboys isn't hard
Hating the Dallas Cowboys comes almost as naturally to New York Giants fans as rooting for our own team. In fact, it's pretty much a requirement.
So, when The Washington Post's football blog, The League, asked me to weigh in on why the Cowboys are one of the most loathed franchises in sports, I was only too happy to oblige.
Here is a small snippet of what I wrote for the Post.
Dallas hasn't won a playoff game since 1996. Yet, ask Cowboy fan and he will tell you his team was the best in the league each and every one of those seasons. Everybody else just got lucky. In the eyes of Cowboy fan, the team has not yet been created that deserves the privilege of stepping on the same field with Dallas.
(Read the full piece here.)
I know you guys heard the story Thursday of how Giants offensive coordinator Kevin Gilbride is on the short list of candidates for the now available Buffalo Bills head coaching job. Well, Ernie Palladino asked KG about the Bills job, and many of you will love what KG had to say.
Gilbride said today that he'd have no trouble accepting the job if the Bills came calling in January. Gilbride said he enjoyed his two years there, from '02-'03, as the offensive coordinator. "I'd certainly be interested," Gilbride said today. "I loved Buffalo and the people. You know, there's nothing much up there, so they're all crazy for the Bills. And I got along with (owner) Ralph Wilson great. "Besides, we're northeast people. I'll go anywhere I have to, and we have, but we'd rather stay in the northeast whenever possible."
Now, before you go and get all excited remember that this is highly unlikely to happen. There is, after all, a long list of potential coaching candidates, including many big-name ones, in line before KG.
You guys also know I have often defended Gilbride, and I happen to agree with the outstanding Giants beat writer Mike Garafolo, who had this to say about KG when reporting the Buffalo story the other day.
"I keep telling you the guy is good and better than you think."
Remember this about fans and offensive coordinators. We were complaining about play calls long before KG came on board, and we will be complaining long after. And we aren't the only ones. Fans around the NFL, and beat writers, make a habit of it.
As an example, in Philadelphia this week even quarterback Donovan McNabb is publicly second-guessing offensive coordinator Marty Mornhinweg.
So, all I'm saying is be careful what you wish for.
Other Stuff
- KG did meet with the media Thursday and actually talked about the Giants. Turns out he was just as confused by the strange interview running backs coach Jerald Ingram gave last week as I was. (Full Gilbride transcript)
- Defensive coordinator Bill Sheridan said the Giants see the returning Aaron Ross as a cornerback, not a safety. (Full Sheridan transcript)
- I'm not sure I believe him, but Brandon Jacobs played the good soldier Thursday and said he isn't bothered by his limited workload in recent weeks. (Full Jacobs transcript)
-
Cornerback Terrell Thomas said Thursday he expects fewer mistakes from the secondary the rest of the season.
"Our defense is hard, it’s complex. Things change at the last second," Thomas said. "Now, they have a good eight games, a good bye week to get adjusted to the defense and how we play it, too – how we play with each other. "It’s hard to line somebody up and say, ‘You’re playing the deep half. This is what you have,’ Something might happen and you have to adjust to it. We didn’t and we were all off. I think we’re back on track as a secondary." - What If Sports simulations have the Giants winning this weekend. The simulations don't mean much, but I always get a kick out of them, anyway.
- SB Nation's NFL Power Rankings, voted on by the football bloggers, show the Colts on top.
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51 comments
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Comments
What if
I ran the game ten times and the Falcons won 6!
Depending on Orton’s status for the game next Thursday we have a good chance to win the next two games.
We have had a serious blip but we have had a chance to regroup and see if the coaches are up to the task!
by G Fan in England on Nov 20, 2009 9:13 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Simulations
What If runs it 10,000 times. Like I said, meaningless but fun.
by Ed Valentine on Nov 20, 2009 9:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah
what if also power ranks the Giants somewhere around 20, the jerks. ANyway, a bunch of us are picking games better than accuscore, so maybe we should ask XLII or G-FaninEngland instead!
You play to win the game!
by Simms-McConkey on Nov 20, 2009 9:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
I have run it a few more times and we have lost more than we won – the funny thing is that it comes up with strange plays – like 60 yard TD runs with 2 seconds left in the half and kicking FGs on the last play of the game when you have already won!
It has been a long time since the Giants have played!
by G Fan in England on Nov 20, 2009 9:22 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
KG to the Bills
I live in Bills land and have seen first hand how the Bills have and always will operate under ralph wilson…they go the cheapest route possible…they always draft a position that they will not have to pay for, always avoid the big names(except for TO which i give credit for on a PR/name recognition move only)…for them to try to get a big name coach would be unheard of…KG will be a cheap buy and very predictable for the team
by NotABillsWesternNY on Nov 20, 2009 10:23 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Defending Kilbride
Ed you and the Mike Garafolo’s of the world can continue to defend Gilbride. Is he a horrible OC? Not at all. The Giants rank near the top in almost every offensive category. His play calling the Giants red zone offense has been terrible.
2007 RZ Attempts 3rd, RZ Success 12th
2008 RZA 2nd, RZS 21st
2009 RZA 4th, RZS 27th
Since 2007 RZA 2nd, RZS 22st
Our success rate has declined each season. The game is about winning. To win a team needs to score points. The Giants settle for too many FGs. In a large part due to the play calling in the RZ. The Chiefs and Lions have a better RZ% than the Giants.
by FrankB0318 on Nov 20, 2009 10:39 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
See....
that’w where some pre-2007 Giants history would make some sense.
They’ll always be the Giants. The RZ has always been thier kryptonite. Even the Giants somehow managed to assemble the greatest show at the Meadowland’s Turf….they’d still suck ass in the RZ.
2007 shows they were 12th. That’s about as good as it gets..and the result of the season is really no coincidence.
This is not Gilbride. This is the NY on the helmet. Deal with it.!
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 20, 2009 11:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Wow, Free!
We agree. This is the way it has always been with the Giants as long as I have been alive. The offense has always been inconsistent, and sometimes infuriating. And when the team has won it has usually been because of stifling defense.
by Ed Valentine on Nov 20, 2009 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So since KG took over our RZ offense has been consistently getting worse, and we should be satisfied with this? And because of some misguided notion of “That’s just the way it is” we shouldn’t try to improve our offensive woes?
by XLII on Nov 20, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yes, this is true, but does that mean we have to like it?
Sometimes I don’t understand why we make some many comparisons to team of the pasts…or even ancient past.
I know we have a lot of values that have been handed down from generation to generation and the team has been w/ the same family forever.
But does that mean we should just accept the fact that we can’t score TDs?
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
by andiamo708 on Nov 20, 2009 11:52 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I guess some teams
have a certain style that they play and carry on that tradition…the Steelers come to mind immediately. Giants too.
but change is inevitable no? Look at the Patriots…a team that has historically sucked…got Belicheck in there….the Defense improves greatly….before you know it they’re an offensive powerhouse ta boot.
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
by andiamo708 on Nov 20, 2009 12:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
but the Steelers won the Super Bowl last year with a pretty bad defense
but an explosive offense. Very different than Steeler teams of the past (even the other Big Ben QB’ed champion). I don’t care how the Giants win, as long as they win.
"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09
by cjmulrain on Nov 20, 2009 3:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You may wanna check your facts on that one.
by XLII on Nov 20, 2009 3:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
whoa
yea, I’m wrong – I looked quickly at their football reference page and mixed up the offensive and defensive columns.
"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09
by cjmulrain on Nov 20, 2009 3:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
really?
a pretty bad difference?
one could argue that the defense won that game for them.
I wouldn’t, but let’s face it…Warner made one mistake…and it cost them….The game. And it’s no easy task to shut down Warner, Fitz, Boldin, Breston.
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
by andiamo708 on Nov 20, 2009 3:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course you should be pissed at it!
I am too.
But its not like in the entire Giants history that they just say…we’re paying the kicker so might as well use him!
Its annoying and frustrating. Its just…they’re the Giants. THere’s really nothing you can do.
Of course they’ve tried to improve it, but it doesn’t work.
I say Fire Mara and Tisch…they’re the Red Zone Jinx.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 20, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lol...
lets not go there…
but getting boss involved down there would be a nice start.
I remember last year when we had trouble scoring TD’s in the Pitt Game.
the following week we came out vs. Dallas and scored a TD on almost every trip to the Red Zone. I’m not sure if Boss got one or maybe Darcy Johnson but that play action to Jacobs will usually get your TE open…if they can get off the line that is.
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
by andiamo708 on Nov 20, 2009 12:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t buy that at all and I’d be terrified if anyone in the Giants organization had the same defeatist mentality you have. What if TC said in his next press conference “It’s just, we’re the Giants, there’s really nothing we can do”?
by XLII on Nov 20, 2009 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well they shouldn't...
they probably don’t even know it, or at least 90% of the players don’t (Canty probably does..he grew up a Giants fan)
The owners probably know it.
I’m talking as a fan…hard to fathom… I know (/) but that’s just what I’ve seen in watching the Giants since 1995 (and actually know what’s going on since around 2000).
Also, my dad has been a fan since the 60’s. I used to always ask WTF, why can’t we score in the RZ….
His reply? “They’re the frickin Giants..they’ve always done this crap”.
That’s always. Whether they win the SB or come in last place. Always.
Its just something, like an omen, on the team.
So don’t buy it if you want. Go ask a Giants fan who’s been watching for 3x as long as you have, see what they say to that.
I don’t understand it either, but its just the way it is.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 20, 2009 3:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you’re in the wrong city; Chicago is 800 miles west of here. New York doesn’t care much for omens, not since 94 at least.
By the way, I am looking all over for red zone stats but can’t find any. I can’t even find some for this season, let alone decades past. Anyone got any good sites?
by XLII on Nov 20, 2009 3:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well that's winning....
if your talking about NOT winning like Chicago…that’s the Green team that plays in the Giants stadium and the Knicks.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 20, 2009 6:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
FB and Ed
I believe that those teams in the Glory Years might have something to do with the Giants’ Os since. When we had Tittle, we had the best O in the NFL (granted we had a great D as well.) The problem then was freakish weather in championship games that negated YA’s aerial circus. Since then, the Giants have always focused on the run to avoid the disasters that they experienced in some of those championship games. I think they believe the weather works to their advantage even though the SB is played in warm weather sites. That probably was one reason their new stadium isn’t domed.
by blue gonz on Nov 20, 2009 12:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
One would think..
That if you sign a multi-million dollar pain-in-the-arse receiver, you’d at least throw the ball to the freak and see what happens..All Owens has done up there is sell tickets..I feel sorry for the fans in Buffalo..They are being Buffaloed…again.
by Bobbiblue on Nov 20, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
this is pretty interesting...
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
by andiamo708 on Nov 20, 2009 11:21 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, it's about winning
And last time I checked the Giants have done an awful lot of that with KG calling the plays. I know he’s not perfect, but I doubt the perfect play-caller has ever been born.
by Ed Valentine on Nov 20, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If I were to give that perfect play-caller award out..
It would go to the likes of Landry, Walsh, and Stram..Those guys invented wrinkles that are still used today..The funny thing about Landry was that he used his knowledge of defense to create things on offense…and none of them had a bad red zone offense…Nowadays teams are just running the same ’ol crap that is based on what guys like I mentioned invented..If you read the same book every week for thirty years, you should probably be able to recite it. There are no OC inventors out there anymore..just re-runs.
by Bobbiblue on Nov 20, 2009 12:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Parcells...
not an OC or a master mind offensively… but worked with what he had…and was very successful.
You look at what he did down in Miami and it’s actually remarkable….even with Chad Pennington at QB. Heck he even got Drew Bledsoe to the SB too.
it’s not always the big plays that fuel your offense…sometimes a little (or a lot) of restraint can go a long way.
"If you don't know what you're doing... just rush the quarterback" - LT
by andiamo708 on Nov 20, 2009 12:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You are right about Parcells..
I love that guy..but his success was being the absolute ultimate motivator..which is what he is..I used to love watching him with the players, needling them..He set up LT putting a pounding on Jumbo Elliot because he knew he was going to face Bruce Smith in the Super Bowl. Parcells is a genious of the entire game..not just one facet of it..a nicer version of Vince Lombardi.
by Bobbiblue on Nov 20, 2009 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'll admit
Besides KG and Payton, i can’t think of any other OC we’ve had that could diversify the passing game? Prior to them, it seemed like the Giants were in an era where passing was an afterthought and as a fan, i’ve always wanted an OC that wasn’t afraid to pass the ball.
So i’m glad KG has the willingness, but he needs to have a happy mixture of the short-intermediate stuff too. That’s where i think he frustrates us! But, if he does moves on, he moves on and it’s out of our control. Perhaps a more TE-friendlier OC can be brought in!
by Hootman on Nov 20, 2009 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
OC
Yeah, only OC I can recall from the past is Ron Erhardt and people use to bitch about his conservative play calling as well. I can remember at giant stadium seeing a standing ovation on a deep ball that wasn’t even close to being completed. Fans were so happy to just see the ball go downfield.
by JG131 on Nov 20, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah..
We’ve always had a lousy red zone offense, but now we have a lousy red zone defense..That’s the difference..2+2= Lose.
by Bobbiblue on Nov 20, 2009 11:12 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
yea...
we could use one of those Redskins goal-line stands. Much better than the end zone chauffeur’s they’ve been thus far.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 20, 2009 11:19 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
speaking of hatin'
For the second time, I’ll mention Bert Sugar’s book “I hate the Dallas Cowboys.” A lot of it is annoying because some of the essayists say it’s “because they’re so good.” but some of it’s fun to read. Flip through it at a bookstore, maybe you’ll take it home
You play to win the game!
by Simms-McConkey on Nov 20, 2009 11:51 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Doesn't take much to hate the Cowboys..
I can’t for the life of me understand this “America’s Team” jazz..How did they deserve that proclamation?..Bull, I say..I do have to be careful though because my wife is a Cowboys fan..In an effort to preserve “Marital Bliss”..I, for example, most recently last Sunday will say things like:“Oh geez baby I can’t believe Romo threw that pass”..“Gosh, why are they not throwing to Witten more?”..blah blah blah..(inside I’m thinking, YES!! lose you bums..I also look for things that are entertaining to me while being forced to watch a Dallas game..like catching Jones on his new TV set picking his nose and stuff like that..anything to survive the game and keeping my marriage intact
by Bobbiblue on Nov 20, 2009 12:31 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
"america's team"
I never really understood it either. I don’t even think they have the largest fanbase as everyone says they do, the Giants are always topping TV ratings records all the time.
by nygmp42 on Nov 20, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes NYG..good point..
When we think about it the largest fan bases are us, Washington and Philly..In other divisions probably the same..Where did the Cowboys deserve this America’s team monikor?…I guess their fan base is a legend in their own minds…Since Landry was ceremoniously treated like a piece of crap by Jones..and Johnson had the trade of the history of the game for Walker (and won)..They have done absolutely nothing..They need to stop smoking cowpies over there.
by Bobbiblue on Nov 20, 2009 12:58 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I'd add 2 to that
The steelers and the bears have huge fanbases.
Speaking of predictions, 1050 ESPN in NY did a Madden simulator and predicted us to a 28-7 win, with Jacobs racking up 80+ yards and a touch.
by wilddre22 on Nov 20, 2009 1:25 PM EST via mobile reply actions 0 recs
Yeah and..
You could add the Packers and Browns and Colts to the list as well..
by Bobbiblue on Nov 20, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
absolutely
the packers. forgot about them.
by wilddre22 on Nov 20, 2009 2:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
and the Patriots
What bothers me about the “America’s Team” crap is that it was a self-imposed nickname. That’s total BS. That’s like George Costanza trying to get people to call him T-Bone. And amazingly enough, it stuck.
"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09
by cjmulrain on Nov 20, 2009 3:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes CJ, but I was thinking about the long tradition of fans..
That have been rooting for their teams forever..not these expansion franchises like the Cowboys and Patriots, etc.. To say the Cowboys is America’s team is a joke..and it is kind of odd that we haven’t seen a Cowpoke fan show up yet here..doesn’t really matter..Our site has class..The only time I get a little PO’d is when the trolls show up and try to ‘dis my teammates..which would be you guys..I have been known to rocket launch them..I don’t do that to them when I visit their sites and I expect the same respect in return.
by Bobbiblue on Nov 20, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I would give an ear for that outcome right now
You play to win the game!
by Simms-McConkey on Nov 20, 2009 1:35 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Hating the "Cowgirls" ..
My first words, " Dad. i hate the Cowboys" …we were brought up that way…We need to pass this tradition on to our children………..
"18-1, write that book! ! "
by SB42 Living-a-Dream on Nov 20, 2009 2:25 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I am utterly shocked
that this post has been up for a seven hours and not a single Cowboys fan has chimed in yet.
"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09
by cjmulrain on Nov 20, 2009 3:44 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
LOL!!
I even made sure the lead blogger over at the Cowboys site knew about it.
by Ed Valentine on Nov 20, 2009 3:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Regarding Gilbride
I don’t think he’s the best O-coordinator, and I also don’t think he’s the worst. I’d put him somewhere in the middle of the pack – some weeks he’s closer to the top 10 and others he’s closer to the bottom 10. I don’t think he should be fired by any means, but I also wouldn’t be heartbroken if he got a head coaching job somewhere else.
"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09
by cjmulrain on Nov 20, 2009 3:49 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
great minds, George
great minds…
"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09
by cjmulrain on Nov 21, 2009 3:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 20, 2009 6:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The America's Team nickname
came from an NFL Films producer who was looking for a catchy title for one of those season yearbooks they make. I am too lazy right now to go and look up who it was. Like a good case of E.Coli or flesh-eating virus it stuck (probably some 70’s version of Berman kept pounding it into people’s heads).
Homer: Aw, twenty dollars! I wanted a peanut!
Homer's Brain: Twenty dollars can buy many peanuts!
Homer: Explain how!
Homer's Brain: Money can be exchanged for goods and services!
Homer: Woo-hoo!
by bigbluethruandthru on Nov 20, 2009 6:40 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

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