New York Giants News & Notes: Playoffs? You Kidding Me? Playoffs?
by cjmulrain on Nov 11, 2009 7:00 AM EST
in News
58 comments
I hope you'll indulge me the title of this post, but much of the discussion regarding the Giants the past few days has reminded me of Jim Mora's famous rant back in 2001. Obviously the most important thing right now is for the Giants to use their bye week to figure out what has gone wrong, try to fix it, and come up with a big win against the Falcons. Bob Glauber of Newsday has 5 improvements he believes will get the Giants back to playing playoff caliber football.
Steve Serby, on the other hand, believes the playoffs are "Mission: Impossible."
Ralph Vachianno reports that the Giants still see themselves as Super Bowl contenders, and that despite the outcome on Sunday, there was a lot to like. Paul Schwartz of the NY Post offers a similar take.
Brandon Jacobs
Matt Mosley reports that Brandon Jacobs talked about the Giants skid on ESPN 1050, where he defended his now impossible 13 win prediction. Jacobs on the prediction:
"That’s one I’m going to have to deal with for making that prediction. That’s what I really thought then. We had a good team and I really believed that. It just so happened that we have not been playing as good of football as we can play and have penalties and those mistakes. [We're] really beating ourselves."
Speaking of Jacobs, Tom Coughlin sees no problem with the distribution of carries, despite the underutilization of a very effective Brandon Jacobs the past few weeks. This has been perhaps the most perplexing thing about the Giants this season: through the first 5 games, when Jacobs was struggling to a 3.6 YPC average, he was getting 20 carries a game. The past 4 weeks his YPC has gone up to 5.1, but he's only been getting 12.75 carries per game. Maybe one has to do with the other, but from watching the games it seems like the old Brandon Jacobs right from the get-go, and they're just not giving him the ball.
Coaching Questions
Sort of related to the Brandon Jacobs stuff as well as Ed's post from yesterday, Josh Alper of NBC Sports believes that the Giants must use the bye week to put their players in a position to succeed. Couldn't agree more.
Giants great Phil Simms was also critical of some of the coaching decisions on Sunday, and has the benefit of questioning them before they even happened.
Happier Days
The New York Times' Fifth Down blog continues their countdown of the 10 greatest Giants moments at Giants Stadium with a look at Jason Sehorn's incredible interception of a Donovan McNabb pass during the 2000 playoffs. Prior to Super Bowl XLII, this was my all-time favorite Giants play that I vividly remember watching live. Great memories. It's too bad they had to cancel the Super Bowl that year, I really think the Giants could have won it after that beatdown they gave the Vikings...
Interesting footnote: Check out how fast McNabb is moving at the tail end of the video - it's easy to forget that he used to be as much a running threat as he was a passing threat.
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Jake did have 20 carries in the Eagles game...
and 12 of em were in the 1st half.
I think he was banged up and in and out (Bradshaw is no less hurt than he’ll be…) so maybe that’s why?
I think Danny Ware needs to get touches. I think they have a good back there, but I don’t know.
They played fine on Sunday. I think Glauber even said Sheridan’s gameplan was “brilliant” until the final drive (I dunno about that…but they were pretty good up to that point).
I didn’t know ELi checked out of a pass play on 3rd down. He needs to stop being “Elisha” and get back to being Eazy E. Everyone blaming Glibride and Coughlin needs to shut up. Cuz that’s on E right there (coach can only call the plays..if the QB checks out of it..what are you gonna do?
Not sure what the coaches do tho. Do they strip away Eli’s audible’s? Can’t do that…..
I really can’t believe I read that Eli checked out of it. I lost a little bit of respect for Eli Manning after tthat.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 7:57 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
But
if Eli was told not to take any risks and settle for a FG for a 6 point lead you can understand why seeing the defensive formation he went to the run play.
The call we should be discussing is the first down WR screen to Nicks that gained zero yards. The Db’s have the back of the end zone to protect them so they can play close to the LOS – so that was a strange play in that situation.
by G Fan in England on Nov 11, 2009 8:14 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
meh..
they could be playing the pass. The Giants were covering the pass on SD’s final TD drive, didn’t help them out much.
Just cuz a team’s playing to defend the pass (or run for that matter) doesn’t always mean you gotta check out of it.
It just seems that they play defense on themselves when they get in the Red Zone. The defense should be the ones with their backs against the wall.
Calling a run play almost worked, yea. But I’d still rather them at least try one pass.
I know what your saying on the WR screen. THat play’s worked for them a lot. I actually liked the play call, but the throw by Eli was off and didn’t allow Nicks to make any sort of move.
THen there were 2 runs. There just has to be a ball thrown into the end zone. There just has to be.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 8:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
A sideways pass and two runs is not getting the bal downfield when a score wins the game barring an onside kick recovery.
by G Fan in England on Nov 11, 2009 9:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I like the
WR screen at midfield where the defenders are more spread out. There’s not as much room for the play to develop at the 14.
by FrankB0318 on Nov 11, 2009 11:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You know
I had a terrible nightmare about that canceled Super Bowl… The Giants got killed, with their only offense coming on a kick return. The Ravens just murdered (oops… sorry Ray, I meant kille… I mean defeated) the Giants. It was awful.
by brisulph on Nov 11, 2009 8:38 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Reevaluate the 53...
The public statement is the 53 they’ve got are the 53 they’re going with. That’s fine for us to mull over. But behind closed doors, they’ve got to do some reevaluating at key positions, and be willing to make the very tough call when there’s a smarter, more gifted athlete available. Danny Clark and AP are not today what we think of as Giants quality linebackers against the pass or run. The speed and smarts of Boley makes a dramatic difference when he’s on the field, but he can’t make up for the other two. The LBs don’t make each other better. Ross may be ready for the Falcons, but if he’s not, they can’t have a dramatic drop off in talent to the backup.
by buljos on Nov 11, 2009 8:39 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
LBs
We’ve already seen a slight change, as Sintim was playing on passing downs instead of Clark and it made a world of difference. I’m wondering if he should just be given a shot at completely replacing Clark though? I know he’s known as a pass rushing specialist, but he was pretty good against the run in college and played well in coverage in the preseason. I want to see more of him.
As for AP, we’re stuck with him.
As for CBs, I think we’re ok there. Thomas was very good this past week & Bruce Johnson played very well. Hopefully Ross coming back means more help for those safeties (who played better, but it seemed the Giants were trying to make sure they didn’t have to cover too much).
by potroast on Nov 11, 2009 8:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The thing is, with Clark in there....
…every down becomes a good passing down. It seemed to me that SD threw a lot on first down, and I can’t say I blame them given our personnel package typically in the game at that time. You see a weakness, and you try to exploit it. I expect more teams to throw at us on down and distance when run is anticipated.
I’m conflicted, though, because part of me dislikes ripping the LBs, in particular Clark because he is such a decent guy off the field. As a unit they need to play lights out over the second half of the season if we are to have a chance at turning the ship around.
by Step up and make big plays on Nov 11, 2009 9:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
"every down becomes a good passing down"
Right & exactly why I want to see more of Sintim.
by potroast on Nov 11, 2009 9:14 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Less Clark,
sure. Less Blackburn, too. Let’s see what the young guys can do.
by blue gonz on Nov 11, 2009 9:37 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
53
Problem is, halfway through the season you can’t make dramatic changes to the roster. There are no impact players to be had.
by Ed Valentine on Nov 11, 2009 9:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
true..
the Broncos signed Ty Law and Mitch Burger to be their Feagles.
I don’t really think those worked…..
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 10:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
saw this morning
that TC brought in 14 free agents for tryouts…14! mainly kickers and punters but also some lineman and DBs.
no good names in the bunch but at least they’re looking for options. my vote is still bring on vince anderson!
by cntrlalt on Nov 11, 2009 10:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Disagree w/ Bob Glauber's comment that...
…Sheridan’s game plan wasn’t brilliant up until the last drive. The execution on the defensive side of the ball was simply better last week than in the previous three losses.
I don’t know how his scheme could be called brilliant when you have two of the better pass rushers in the league dropped back in coverage on a handful of snaps that lead to key first down conversions for the opponent.
by Step up and make big plays on Nov 11, 2009 8:41 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
you can have a brilliant game-plan...
and it could backfire.
I don’t understand the ripping of Sheridan of the dropping the DE’s. I know it something he said he would get rid of, but its something that Spags did and no one really called him what they call Sheridan (even in Spag’s first year)
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 8:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Can you think of a time when this has ever been effective?
I mean, we have had our problems with our front four getting to the QB during the losing streak. With this in mind, why would you drop your two best edge rushers into the pattern — just to confuse the offense and keep them guessing? We we’re getting fairly good pressure from the front four on Sunday, which only makes those calls more suspect in my mind. It’s the coordinator’s job to put personnel in the position to where they can have the greatest success. Let the DEs do what they do best, which is not cover TEs 15 yards down the field.
by Step up and make big plays on Nov 11, 2009 8:52 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yea..actually...
I could have swore Tuck almost had an INT in the Saints game.
I agree, I don’t like it. I think if they must use it, Kiwaunka should be the only one to do it cuz he at least has some sort of experience as a LB.
I’m pissed to teh nth degree that they use it…but its just something the Giants have been doing and their success on it is like 20%..so I have no clue why (but they’ve been doing it since 2007…)
I’d much rather them ’blitz" TUck and let Boley drop back into coverage.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 9:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ah, good point
If they want to do it, then let Kiwi do it. Makes sense.
by potroast on Nov 11, 2009 9:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
one man's brilliance is another's sutpidity
Whoa hold on there let’s not put Sheridan’s name in their with Spags. i don’t care if Spags droped the D tackles into coverage, the bottom line is Spags schemes worked and for the most part Sheridans have not. At this point Sheridan is making me wish Tim Lewis was back!
by Late for Dinner on Nov 11, 2009 4:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the funny thing is...
Sheridan got his schemes from Spags.
Its actually more of a “when” type thing that’s hurt him.
Spags benefited from years of listening to Jim Johnson with the Eagles. Sheridan only 2 years with Spags and before theat with Tim Lewis.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 4:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Here's the part of Glauber's column
that bugs me.
A source familiar with the Giants’ play-calling told me that Eli Manning was the one who decided to check out of a pass play on the third-and-goal from the 9 and have Jacobs run it. Head coach Tom Coughlin and offensive coordinator Kevin Gilbride have taken the bulk of the criticism, but put Manning in there, too. You’ve got to take ashot at the endzone.
It reminds of the line in ‘The Replacements,’ “Winners always want the ball.” If Eli checked out of pass it bothers me that he didn’t at least drop back, take a look and throw the ball away if he had no shot.
by Ed Valentine on Nov 11, 2009 9:49 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
yup.
The fact that Eli checked out of it angers me more than if Gilbride/Coughlin called a straight up run.
Brady, Peyton, Rivers, Brees, Big Ben..etc. Whoever you want to name, all the best in the game all want the ball in their hands there. They don’t care if they think their RB can overpower the defense. THey don’t care about a incomplete pass or a sack (10 yard line to say…even 20 yard line, FG still is in order). They don’t even think they’ll throw a pick.
You gotta shoot the end zone. WHo the hell cares if they’re “playing the pass”. Of course they’re playing the pass…..
Really. Piss poor judgement by Eli. Yea, he was almost right in his check down cuz Jake almost got in.
Still. F the run. You gotta shoot the end zone. I can’t believe that he checked out of it…..
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 10:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As I said above
If Eli was told don’t throw an int or a sack etc you can see why he made the adjustment, unless of course the D baited Eli into changing the play but were ready for the run all the way!
We will only know if we ask Eli and is he likely to tell us the answer!
by G Fan in England on Nov 11, 2009 10:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
agreed
honestly, he should have dropped back, and if you don’t have anything, just go down. That way, worst case scenario is you run the clock the same as a run play. It’s not like taking a sack would have taken them out of field goal range.
"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09
by cjmulrain on Nov 11, 2009 11:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd say
Just throw the ball out of the end zone rather than take the sack. But, same idea. Drop back and see if you can find something instead of just give in to the defense w/out trying.
by Ed Valentine on Nov 11, 2009 12:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well you want the clock to still run
But its old news now. Can’t wait until next sunday
The Cowboys are the France of the NFL
-thwalls
On 3rd down, throw it to Smith.
by Willgfass on Nov 11, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No Sirreeee....
The most IMPORTANT thing is the Cowboys are on top of the NFC-East…1 1/2 games ahead of you clowns…that is more important…FEAR THE STAR
by Hawgz, Bugz, and FilthyFowl Hater on Nov 11, 2009 10:43 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Yes...
YES!!!!!
THE NOVEMBER BANDWAGON IS UPON US!!!!!
LOL!!!
….you guys never learn.
Oh yea…Giants beat the Cowboys already. Move along…….
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 10:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think I just collapsed a lung laughing so hard at this too
1 1/2 games ahead
you…you can’t be serious man…
1 1/2 games…Oh man..thanx for brightening up the week.
You do stand up?
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 10:52 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Please just disregard that statement
We are proud fans on BTB, and would not like to be represented by someone who comes over here just to sh** talk. Don’t stereotype all Boys fans
by witten82 on Nov 11, 2009 2:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't...
and there’s been more than a few, like you, who come over here and actually try to talk football.
I mean congrats on leading the division, the Cowboys are playing well and I’d love for the Giants to be playing as well as you guys right now.
He doesn’t seem like someone from BTB anyway…
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 3:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
When?
When’s the last time the Cowgirls won a playoff game? Come back week 16.
by FrankB0318 on Nov 11, 2009 11:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Explain your merriment so we can all have a Giggle...(oh there I go again)
You are a game and a half ahead of us…if that makes you laugh, you should read the funny papers on Sunday…The Sports section where they talk about the Gnats chances of making the Playoffs…LMMFAO…FEAR THE STAR
by Hawgz, Bugz, and FilthyFowl Hater on Nov 11, 2009 10:58 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
why should we fear them?
we already beat them.
by cntrlalt on Nov 11, 2009 11:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yea...
we’ve heard “Fear the Star” in November since 1996.
How’s that worked.
Keep amusing us all with your ‘confidence’ in your team in November.
I don’t see any of the rational Cowboy fans coming in and talking stuff (…especially cuz the Giants beat the Cowboys already this year…)
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 11:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Fear????
No, your a good team and don’t need to fear any team, you have a chance to win every week but so do the Cowboys,
The Cowboys are not the team many Giants fans want to believe them to be.
by Musiccitynorm on Nov 11, 2009 11:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't mean to say that to a rational fan...
I know the Cowboys are good..what they are and what they are fully capable of this season.
THis kid’s just really annoying and its just kinda random where its coming from.
We don’t play the Cowboys for a couple weeks and I guess it may be besides the point…already won already.
I never counted the Cowboys out..I wanted them to go 0-16 but their start is not surprising at all.
But its just this Fowlhater dude that’s a little annoying don’t you think?
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 11:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
I’ve never even seen him on BTB. Talking smack on another blog, and just the way he is typing though is more embarassing to us as fans. At least you don’t have fans coming to are blog with this “omg u suck lmfao” crap.
by witten82 on Nov 11, 2009 2:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, i'm giving BTB regulars the benefit of the doubt here
That Cowboy fan fella with the long name, then coming here for the first time and calling us all clowns, doesn’t seem too normal! We all debate etc… but insults like that are pretty rare.
Were better than that, and i’m sure 99% of Dallas fans are too!
by Hootman on Nov 11, 2009 2:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I hope not...
tho, I’m sure they would if the Giants and Cowboys’s season’s were swapped.
You just can’t help the fools that come out of the woodwork…yet, they’re always annoying and make a fanbase look stupid (just like the few Saints fans coming over here to talk crap).
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 3:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I know what your saying
But it’s obvious. As it is annoying that some sign up on BBV just to kick us when were down and to spew nonsense vs. others that will logically debate, when it matters the most, when we play each other. This is a random act of nonsense, we don’t play the Cowboys for a few weeks!
No justification for it!
by Hootman on Nov 11, 2009 3:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you guys have a good community at BTB
I’ve never had a problem with any of the regulars from over there. Even Terry is just passionate, if a little over the top sometimes
"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09
by cjmulrain on Nov 12, 2009 8:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
When was the last time anyone "feared the star"???
by Step up and make big plays on Nov 11, 2009 11:03 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Just so you guys know
This guy has already been banned here, and his comments deleted. He has also been warned and sternly rebuked at Blogging the Boys. If he somehow shows up again, please just ignore him. We are above his kind of nonsense, and so are most of the folks at BTB.
by Ed Valentine on Nov 11, 2009 4:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is stupid...
Why are we even having this discussion? The cowboys are a good team sure, but 1.5 games up in November??? How many times has that made a difference? Who thought the chargers at 4-8 were going to make the playoffs last year? None of this matters, lets keep the hate talk out of here…
Btw, im not going to say our superbowl win was a fluke, but even if it was ill take that over no playoff wins in the last 15 years or so. Ill fear the star as you say the next time the cowboys are able to dominate teams in the playoffs and win a superbowl. But lets just start with the cowboys need to win 1 playoff game.
by DaffesFlame on Nov 11, 2009 11:40 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
First post on BBV
Hopefully to change the subject now, that was my first post on BBV and i hope to have many more. I will try my best to be intelligent and calm. This is a great site and should not be fouled up with the stupid arguments between hated rivals.
by DaffesFlame on Nov 11, 2009 11:44 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
What the cowboys have done in the playoffs is a --
- moot point, just as what the Giants did in 07, 08, is moot. Right now - and I am a major G fan — the Cowboys are playing heaps better than our Giants. My prediction for the season — coming on the heels of the Bears preseason game — is panning out exactly the way I saw it, so I will repeat some of it: Cowboys win the division. Giants may, but most probably not, get a WC (I think 8-8 or 7-9 is more realistic).
Cowboys lose to the Saints in the NFC Championship game. (I admit I didn’t see the Saints coming and originally had the Vikings in there, bit I think Favre will tucker out.)
The teams doesn’t have the horses or the answers right now, and this week off will not stop the bleeding (I do think they will beat the Bronco’s though).
Let’s just hope they don’t embarrass themselves Handley/Reeves/Fassel style the rest of the way. Peace to all.
by ZILLAG on Nov 11, 2009 1:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Zill
With all due respect we have already beat the great cowboys, secondly who even says the cowboys are making the playoffs, Even if the Giants Don’t would you really put money on Wade Phillips and the cowboys over the Eagles winning the division. Look the Cowboys have righted the ship so far here in November but untill they have a succesful December I have to think they will struggle to make the playoffs and untill Romo wins a big game there is no way I can see them get a sniff of the NFC championship game even if the Giants don’t make the playoffs. And lastly how can you call yourself a major Giants fan and throw the towel in already. 7 weeks is a lot of football and a lot of things can happen so slow your roll buddy.
by Late for Dinner on Nov 11, 2009 4:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I've been a Giants fan since '67, I am also a realist who sees the talent for what it is,
doesn’t make me love the brand any less.
by ZILLAG on Nov 11, 2009 6:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So you see no turnaround whatsoever?
Nothing?
The towel’s in?
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 7:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't understand the "I've been a fan since ....." Schtick...
to me, that should be long enough for you to know that no matter how bad a team looks for a certain period of time…they can turn it around.
Yea, some teams can’t. But those are teams like teh Raiders, the Browns, etc.
So you throw in the towel already?
I can’t believe that in 42 years of being a Giants fan you throw in the towel after half the season.
Teams don’t throw in the towel when they are 3-6 right now. The Giants are 5-4.
"It ain't over till its over"---
by FreeBradshaw on Nov 11, 2009 7:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm with you Zillag
After watching other teams with winning records, Our Giants simply doesn’t measure up,
Our DB’s, LB’s, Kickers and coaches are below average,
At this point the team is looking for ways to lose not to win.
Our Giants are not the Giants of 2007, no matter how we wish or hope.
Our Giants can be a super team with some very good draft picks next year.
by Olddiehard on Nov 12, 2009 3:59 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
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