Hooray! A real football post
by Ed Valentine on Dec 2, 2008 1:00 PM EST
in New York Giants News
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Let's get back to talking about football. Our New York Giants are, after all, 11-1 and on the verge of winning the NFC East championship.
The Giants are also heading toward what could be the best regular season in franchise history, at least in the modern era. By the way, I am defining 'modern' as since the league expanded the schedule to 14 games in 1961.
The best record by a Giants team since the league went to 16 games in 1978 was the 14-2 mark posted by the 1986 championship team.
I am not going to get into comparing that team to this one, at least not yet. It's really not a fair, complete comparison until this season ends and we know whether or not this team can bring home another Super Bowl title.
It sure is a lot more fun to talk about this stuff, though, than that other nonsense we have been spending all our time on lately.
- Giants offensive coordinator Kevin Gilbride is often an object of scorn despite the Giants' record and the fact that they have the league's highest-scoring offense. You guys know I have been a Gilbride defender, and this week KG is getting some love from other places.
From Peter King, who named Gilbride his coach of the week.
The Giants never leave unmade plays out there, and the 23-7 win over Washington had some great examples. Domenik Hixon made three first-quarter catches, rendering Plaxico Burress -- for the moment -- obsolete. On consecutive plays in the first quarter, Gilbride called for a direct snap to Derrick Ward (gain of five) and a brilliant screen to Kevin Boss for 24 against a Washington blitz. Gilbride has learned the strengths and weaknesses of Eli Manning, and he and Manning are one in play calling and execution.
From Washington cornerback Fred Smoot ffollowing Sunday's 23-7 Giants' victory.
"When we thought they were gonna throw it, they ran the ball," he said. "When we thought they were gonna run it, they threw it. They always kept us on our heels. They were always one step ahead of us."
So, Giants' fans I have to ask. I know I have beaten this drum before, but when do we start throwing some love Gilbride's way for the offensive monster he has helped to create?
Gilbride is not perfect. We can all find a couple of play calls in every game that make us shake our collective heads, but when is the last time the Giants had a truly flawed offensive game plan? Last season against Buffalo, maybe.
Gilbride will never be the hot head coaching commodity defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo is. He has already had his opportunity to do that, and failed (6-16 with San Diego). There is also other baggage with Gilbride (his sideline fight with Buddy Ryan that will never be forgotten).
Let's give Gilbride some props, though. Sunday against Washington we saw some things from the Giants we had not seen all season. A direct snap to Derrick Ward, a beautiful tight end screen to Kevin Boss, a quick screen to a split out Ward that went for 48 yards.
These things tell you that Gilbride is still expanding the Giants' repertoire, still looking for new, creative, explosive ways to use the weapons at his disposal.
Give him some credit for recognizing what Steve Smith can do and utilizing him. For continuing to find ways to increase Boss's role. For building a creative running attack that does more than plow straight ahead, but one that takes advantage of the athleticism of its offensive lineman with lots of pulling and movement.
Give him some credit for doing what he did to Smoot and the Redskins -- leaving a defense unable to figure out what is coming next.
The results tell you no one is doing his job better than Gilbride right now.
Your thoughts?
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I was a Gilbride hater
Mostly it was the goal-line play calling. Sometimes it was the running play on 3rd and 17. Sometimes it was three straight runs up the middle from the 3. And nothing rankles me more than three incomplete passes-and-out. (I recall myself in a frothing rage shouting, early this season, “What are you trying to be, the Patriots? We BEAT the Patriots!”) But a little perspective. I would never get my resume in the hands of a high school football coach for an assistant position. And Gilbride is an 11-1 coordinator with a ring. So ultimately you gotta just accept that when it looks stupid, there’s a fair chance we just don’t get it.
I think he’ll get some props for balancing the attack well this year. He’s done a good job. But I’m not enamored of his brilliance for the same reason I never thought Phil Jackson was a coaching demi-god. He’s got the best offensive line in the league, the strongest 3-headed running attack, a great spread of receivers, a good quarterback, and above average tight ends and fullback. If we had a hall-of-fame O.C. we’d probably be putting up 40+ points per game. Anyway, I’m gald we’re not. I’m creepily afraid of parallels with the Patriots. Such as this morning, when a drunk coworker crowed to me that our Giants were going to the Superbowl, where they’d win.
I asked him if he remembered who was sure to win the Superbowl last year at this time.
Gilbride
has done a very good job this year. Like Simms-McConkey above, there are certain things about Gilbride that drive me mad, especially the goal line play calling, but sometimes you have to wonder whether it’s the play calling or the players not executing in those situations: with our O-line and Jacobs there’s no excuse for not getting into the end zone inside the 5, no matter what plays Gilbride calls.
The reason why that happens
Is because Eli is given three possible plays to run every snap of the ball. After Eli gets the team to the line, he makes the actual play calls. Not sure exactly what it signifies, but this is why you often hear “Omaha” at the line of scrimmage. Often he needs to the last possible second to call the play he wants. Granted, it has its flaws with the occasional delay of games, but overall I would say it works.
So its not really a matter of getting the play on time, its a matter of getting three plays on time, and getting the right one called based on what the defense is showing and the ball snapped on time.
Giants fan from the womb to the tomb
NY Ranger fans talk all things Blueshirts at
http://broadwayblueview.blogspot.com/
by Jim Schmiedeberg on Dec 2, 2008 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
I was
worried about the DOG penalties. But the more and more games I watch, I rarely notice us getting penalized pre-snap. Eli has a very good idea of play clock management. In the Skins game he was adubilizing as the Skins try to mask their coverage and blitz, he kept throwing around the cadences and pointing to guys he wanted picked up and right when the play clock was at 1 about to go to 0 he steppe back called a TO and converted when he returned (or at least I believe he did). That right there showed me he is in complete control of this offense. There is nothing new anymore for him. He is becoming an intelligent signal caller. Which I believe is what “clicked” last year.
On another note
Ed, Gilbride sucks and you know it, stop defending him!!!!
Kidding….
Giants fan from the womb to the tomb
NY Ranger fans talk all things Blueshirts at
http://broadwayblueview.blogspot.com/
by Jim Schmiedeberg on Dec 2, 2008 1:48 PM EST reply actions
"Gilbride is not perfect...," etc.
What Offensive Coordinator is? Like Simms and CJ, those goal line failures bug me, but I think a lot of that is attributable to BJ’s height, the fact that he runs straight up (not as much as he once did) and doesn’t have a quick burst to the hole. He’s a big target in those goal line scrums.
The best in short yardage goal line situations I can recall was OJ’s buddy who played for USC and Oakland before having a falling out with Al Davis. I can’t believe I can’t call up the guy’s name—he’s an HOFer. Any way, he was shortish,had a quick start, ran low to the ground and somehow seemed to be able to drive through (or under?) those goal line pile ups. Marcus someone maybe?
Yup
Thanks. He was unbelievable at getting those last few yards for a TD.
by george cronin on Dec 2, 2008 4:46 PM EST up reply actions
Maurice Jones-Drew
is another (extreme) example of that type of player (though not nearly in Allen’s class). He’s tiny, but that actually makes him better in short yardage situations. It seems counter-intuitive at first, but if you think about it it starts to make sense.
The defense has to find a short guy to stop him.
No trouble finding big and wide BJ. An easy target for the guy diving over the pile and slamming into his chest.
by george cronin on Dec 2, 2008 4:49 PM EST up reply actions
George
Are you thinking of Sam"bam " Cunningham. He played for USC along with Anthony Davis and they used to put him in in goal line and he would leap 6’ in the air over everyone in the pile. ………………now I’m dating myself.
We're only gonna score 17 points?
by big blue wrecking crew on Dec 2, 2008 6:16 PM EST up reply actions
he was awesome
in Tecmo Super Bowl – the Raiders with Allen and Bo Jackson were unstoppable in that game…unless you had LT on your defense :)
Speaking of Gilbride
Today’s TMQ on ESPN.com has a good blurb on him:
"On the subject of scoring, sports pundits are agog over Jersey/A defensive coordinator Steve Spagnuolo, yet you don’t hear a peep regarding the team’s offensive coordinator, Kevin Gilbride — though the Giants are first in scoring. Gilbride is not an out-of-nowhere phenom like Spagnuolo, and the media love phenoms. Gilbride has been around the horn many times in the NFL, and has run many offenses that sputtered. But now his charges have won the Super Bowl and lead the league in scoring. How about some recognition?
Another strike against Gilbride may be that the Giants’ offense is conventional. Two backs, no weird sets, no claim of revolutionary tactics. The Giants’ offense is playing traditional football, and playing it well. On Sunday, in bad weather against a stout Redskins defense, the Giants put 23 points on the board and controlled the clock. Early in the game, Washington choked up on the line of scrimmage to stop the Giants’ power rushing, so Eli Manning threw the ball repeatedly, including a lovely old-fashioned “chip-and-pop” to tight end Kevin Boss. Once Washington backed off, Gilbride switched to calling running plays. Nothing revolutionary, just effective. Give the guy some credit already."
Gilbride
At this point in time I have to kind of hand it to the guy. Historicaly I havent bent over backwards to compliment him………..ever since the Buddy Ryan thing. Thing is, I go out of my way to ackowledge the improvements made for example by Domenick Hixon this year(learning to drag his feet in bounds in preseaon, last year by game 16 it became obvious that Craig Dahl had drasticaly improved since he blundered around in pre season. So it’s only fair to acknowledge KB, he’s not calling the same dumb west coast offense he did at Tennesee and , who among us didn’t give a little laugh and some credit at the direct snap to Ward, The best attribute a coach can have is to know your players talents and weaknesses and exploit the talents. Gilbride ,if nothing else is doing that.
We're only gonna score 17 points?
by big blue wrecking crew on Dec 2, 2008 3:50 PM EST reply actions
Oh and
THANKS for a football post!
We're only gonna score 17 points?
by big blue wrecking crew on Dec 2, 2008 3:55 PM EST reply actions
What baggage?
The only reason I’d criticize Gibride in connection with the Buddy Ryan incident is that he didn’t lay Ryan on his ass. Ryan is a thug best known for putting bounties on QBs.
And I wouldn’t hold Gilbride’s failure as head coach against him either. That was just the Peter Principle in action. Sometimes a good OC or DC is just that, not head coach material.
Peter Principle
Not sure where that name comes from, but it should be re-named the Norv Turner principle
The Peter Principle
is a well-known management principle that says that people are promoted to the level of their incompetence and stay there. The Norv Principle, which is a more accurate fit here, says that people are promoted to the level of their incompetence, screw up, get fired and are then hired at the level that they occupied before they were promoted.
Off topic but
I just saw a plug for a replay of the 1958 championship game between the Giants and Colts on ESPN HD December 13. This is a colorized version and I don’t know how I feel about that but I plan to watch it for old times sake. If you want to see Gifford, Robustelli and the boys in their prime, tune in. Also worth watching just to see Unitas.
by giant fan since 57 on Dec 2, 2008 5:27 PM EST reply actions
I'm gonna try to watch that
I love watching old-time sporting events. I’ve only ever seen bits and pieces of that game, will be cool to be able to watch the whole thing. Now I just need to get my hands on a copy of the complete Super Bowl XXI and XXV games
Aargh, don't remind me of that loss.
Did you hear the story of Gifford’s insitence that he made a first down in the closing minute that would have pretty much sewed up a win for the Jints. He argued with the official about it. He lost, of course. On his death bed, the official told his son that “Frank might have been right about making that first down.” Double aargh. Ah, you’re right, it would be fun to watch the guys from the Glory Days again, and Unitas is always a wonder to behold. Best QB ever in my opinion.
Unitas
It’s hard to make comparisons between the greats of 50 years ago and today’s players because of differences in rules and game plans, not to mention the improvements in wieht training and fitness our guys have today.
But in my opinion, Unitas, Namath (and Tittle) could be stars in today’s game, even though they weren’t 6’5" and 225lbs. They had quick releases, and threw the ball every bit as well as todays best even though they lacked the advantage given to modern QB’s. And by that I mean absolutely no penalties for late or excessive hits on passers and freedom by defenders to mug receivers all the way down the field which made it extremely difficult for the old timers to put up numbers like todays guys.
by giant fan since 57 on Dec 3, 2008 5:16 AM EST up reply actions
late or excessive hits
All three of the guys you mention took their share of beatings, particularly Namath, who came into the league with a bum knee. The Giants lost the championship to the Bears when Tittle was hit late with a helmet to the knee, tearing ligaments. I’m surprised you mentioned Joe, but I agree with you about him. Vastly underrated by many in my estimation.
by george cronin on Dec 3, 2008 6:41 AM EST up reply actions
Peter King
has a great post about where the Giants go from here on the field:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/peter_king/12/02/mail/index.html
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