Have the Giants already saved Coughlin's job?

by Ed Valentine on Oct 30, 2007 7:25 AM EDT in New York Giants News

The photo of the smiling Tom Coughlin that accompanies this article speaks volumes about the state of the New York Giants these days.

After seeming to be in turmoil in the pre-season with Michael Strahan pondering retirement, Tiki Blabber running his mouth and questions lingering about Coughlin's job security the Giants are one of the hottest teams in the league.

Six straight wins have changed a lot of things with the Giants. They are a contender, with some even saying they might be the NFC's best team. They appear to be getting along and are so far avoiding the distractions that helped blow up last season. And no one is calling for Coughlin to be fired.

My question is this. Has Coughlin done enough that his job status for next season shouldn't be a question? Or, is he still a second half of the season implosion away from being on the unemployment line?

Personally, I think there is no doubt he has earned the right to stay.

Let me know what you think.

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Hi

New to the site, just found your link on nj.com

I was adamant about firing him after last year, and I have to admit, they have already won more games than I expected. If they make the playoffs, he has to win a game to keep his job. Everybody is happy right now, everybody loves everyone, I keep expecting the Giants to have a John and Yoko sit in at midfield everyone is so in love, but that's easy when you are winning.

Anyway, for now, yeah, you would have to say he deserves to keep the job. Hell, right now he is probably the leading candidate for Coach of the Year.

The more time passes, the more I honestly believe that the biggest problem on that team the last two years is now "sitting on the couch at NBC next to Ann Curry talking about purses and shoes"

by Jim Schmiedeberg on Oct 30, 2007 8:51 AM EDT reply actions

Welcome aboard!!!

I think we agree on that. Love the 'purses and shoes' line. Keep reading and commenting.

by Ed Valentine on Oct 30, 2007 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions

Tiki / TC

Why is everyone still "dissing" Barber? He has been the greatest back for us in recent years. Now, he is just doing his thing, which is partial to why we are 6-2. It is discouraging to me sometimes to read "Blabber" near Tiki's name on this site. Sorry guys, I am still a big fan of his. / As for TC, I have been impressed with the job he is doing. I did not think he would win me over, but he is doing a great job as a coach and as a person with our team.

by Max G-Men on Oct 30, 2007 9:20 AM EDT reply actions

He was a great player

no one doubts or disputes that

But, there were times that it would have been better for the team if he had kept his mouth shut. Now, there have been times that he has shown a lack of class. For example, when Toomer passed him as all time Giants receiver, Tiki did not call and congratulate him

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by NYERinSF on Oct 31, 2007 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions

coughlin hasnt earned anything

yes the 6-2 start is nice. however if this team went 1-7 or 2-6 down the stretch again, would his job still be safe purely based on a 6-2 start? i certainly hope not.

5 of the 6 Giants wins came against the dolphins, falcons, 49ers, jets and eagles (combined 7-27) - and all four of those teams were either without their starting QB or without their best player (westbrook). don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to take anything away from the giants 6-2 start. it's not their fault that they have played some crappy competition lately, especially considering the tough schedules in '05 and '06 that they played through.

i just don't feel like TC has been the difference between a 2-6 team into a 6-2 team. it's great that the team came together despite 0-2 start and bounced back from looking terrible in those first two weeks but alot of coaches would be 6-2 right now against this competition.

if TC can get out of the first round of the playoffs then ill gladly drive him to the Giants team headquarters so he can sign his contract extension. until then, i dont think he "deserves" anything. i think more credit is due to eli's maturation, key players remaining healthy, spag's defensive schematics and a pretty poor schedule thus far.

by SBakerTheTouchdownMaker on Oct 30, 2007 10:28 AM EDT reply actions

That's why

this is a great debate. I hope the Giants also get to the playoffs and win at least one game. I would think, though, that you would be hard-pressed to make a valid argument to get rid of any coach who gets a team to the playoffs three consecutive seasons.

by Ed Valentine on Oct 30, 2007 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions

Tiki/TC

Maxmike, I would never discount what Tiki Barber meant to this team on the field. The point I was trying to make is I think Tiki Barber was a huge distraction off the field. You can't tell me that him announcing his farewell tour midway thru last season did not distract the team. I'm not saying he is the main reason they tanked down the stretch, but it did not help. Then, after he walked away from the Giants, he has done nothing but bad mouth Coughlin. To TC's credit, and again, I am no TC lover, but he has not said a word about Tiki since he left. He has focused on the task at hand, and done a good job of it.

I had the pleasure of meeting Tiki twice, once after his rookie season, and once in 2002. He was very nice to my friends and me, and our picture together still hangs in my house, and always will. That being said, I honestly believe he was a problem for Coughlin, and I think they are both better off without each other, despite the fact that they played a huge part in each others success

by Jim Schmiedeberg on Oct 30, 2007 10:33 AM EDT reply actions

Yes

Yes, I agree with what you said, especially the mid season thing. TC and Tiki did not mix too well either. Don't get me wrong, I did not mean everyone "dislikes" him, its just I read about people's response to Tiki on other sites on how they don't like him anymore, and it gets to me a bit. Well, it really does not matter now since we are playing well. It must have been great to meet Tiki. Just a fan...

by Max G-Men on Oct 30, 2007 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions

ETVal

If the Giants make the playoffs, and go out in the first round again, I think he would have to go. At this point, I can't think of one team the Giants would have to play in a first round playoff game that they shouldn't beat

The only two teams that scare me in the NFC are Dallas and Philly. Even though Philly has struggled, they are still Philly, and weird things have been known to happen when the Giants play Philly. Other than that, right now I truly believe the Giants are the 2nd best team in the NFC. Green Bay is doing it with Favre, smoke and mirrors, Carolina and TB don't impress me, and I don't think an all star team from the NFC West could beat the Giants right now

by Jim Schmiedeberg on Oct 30, 2007 11:20 AM EDT reply actions

Coughlin's fate

Couglin's fate is still to be determined, and it will all be about the second half. 5-3 or better and playoff berth, he returns (and gets some sort of extension, as he'll only have one year left). Now if he goes 4-4 and they lose their playoff game, I could see him getting fired, especially if it is a reeling 4-4. This will show again that the Giants aren't peaking as the playoffs approach. Reese wants a team strong in November/December, and the Giants haven't shown that in Coughlin's four year reign, not yet anyway. No one wants him succeed more than me, but he hasn't clinched anything yet.

www.billkohut.com

by bk0831 on Oct 30, 2007 11:45 AM EDT reply actions

Love a good debate

Passing time on a bye week discussing TC's fate. Good stuff so far on both sides of this argument.

by Ed Valentine on Oct 30, 2007 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions

Well

It just sounds like we're all being smart Giants fans, and being a Giants fan means always looking for that other shoe

Sidenote.....does anyone even know the origin of the phrase "waiting for the other shoe to drop?", I would love to know, since I use the phrase all the time

Weird I know, but I'm on a bye week too

by Jim Schmiedeberg on Oct 30, 2007 12:45 PM EDT reply actions

please dont drop it

I think ever Giants fan has used that phrase a few times in their lives, I've certainly seen it a bunch in the comments here.

I found this about its origin...
http://www.worldwidewords.org/qa/qa-wai1.htm

by mpeters on Oct 30, 2007 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions

keep him

Barring a second half collapse that keeps us out of the playoffs I don't see any reason to fire TC. In the NFL the head coach really does not have much daily interaction with the players, so I don't know how much the coach affects their level of play. That being said, Coughlin has built a level of trust with the veterans on this team and I think it would be a shame for a new coach to have to go through that process. We have too many outspoken players on this team for a new coach to make an easy transition especially if we go after a Bill Cowher type who might try to take a hard line with them.

The players know they are being listened to, because they have seen what its like for TC to ignore them. It is evident not only in the silly bowling stories, but with the coaching changes this offseason. Tim Lewis was obviously not connecting with the defense and TC got rid of him. The play calling wasn't working out so TC handed it over to Gilbride. I think he's shown himself to be more pragmatic than most coaches in this league and that's what the players are seeing.

As far as the idea that he has to win in the playoffs for him to keep his job, I think thats more of a reflection on Eli than the coach. Eli needs to take the next step for the team to do so. If the Giants win a few more games this year that will be three straight years in the playoffs, not many teams can say that.

by mpeters on Oct 30, 2007 1:04 PM EDT reply actions

My Shoe!

MPeters, funny stuff, and it makes perfect sense!

Thanks!!!

by Jim Schmiedeberg on Oct 30, 2007 1:48 PM EDT reply actions

Making the playoffs

The arguement I have to the whole "making the playoffs three years in a row" thing is that while that is a nice achievment, they have to win a playoff game. After 4 years on the job, you want to see progression, and if they go one and done again, its a hard arguement to make that they are progressing. I honestly believe this team is different than the last two seasons, so we'll see. I don't need to retierate the thing about the shoe

by Jim Schmiedeberg on Oct 30, 2007 1:57 PM EDT reply actions

Progression

I agree about that. I do think, though, that 10-11 wins would show progress.

by Ed Valentine on Oct 30, 2007 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions

playoffs

I think making the playoffs with this team would be a huge achievement. Before this season it seemed entirely likely that we would be at the bottom of the NFC east.

I don't agree with the argument that playoff wins would be the only sign of this team progressing. The playoffs in all sports only offer a small sample size of a team's performance. I think whether or not the Giants can beat the good teams left during the regular season(DAL, NE, DET, PHI, CHI) would be a better representation of the progress that has or has not been made.

by mpeters on Oct 30, 2007 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions

we made the playoffs last year?

please, that does not count. that was an accident. i think this is more a referendum on eli's ability to lead a team than coughlin's. at this point, both have bought some time breathing room, but if there is another collapse than maybe you clean house, coach and qb.

by DieEaglesDie on Oct 30, 2007 2:26 PM EDT reply actions

clean house

I think our house is fairly clean as it is. We have two new coordinators this year, a young QB, and young RB's. I read somewhere that the Giants have the third youngest team in the league. Even with a second half collapse, the only changes I see being made is possibly a new head coach and a Strahan retirement.

If the Giants were 2-6 right now we would be considering this a rebuilding year with a nice core group of young guys (Eli, Jacobs, D-line). As it is they have created all these expectations, but I don't think a collapse would call for blowing the team up.

by mpeters on Oct 30, 2007 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions

One thing I don't agree with

Is the sentiment that if Coughlin goes, Eli has to go too. I'm still convinced Eli is the QB of the future for the Giants. He isn't Peyton, and is never going to be. But you know what? With the Giants style of offense, he doesn't have to be. Eli is still young, still learning, and I think he at times this season has looked more comfortable than ever. He'll get there.

Remember one thing:

If the Giants had given up on Phil Simms at Eli's age, that might be one big empty trophy case in the lobby of Giants Stadium, and us Giant fans might be hearing about the

"Curse of the Sam(Huff)bino"

I believe in Santa, and Eli

by Jim Schmiedeberg on Oct 30, 2007 3:27 PM EDT reply actions

Why worry?

The Giants are actually in a great position here. They have Coughlin signed through next year, so they really have the luxury of seeing out this season before they have to make any decisions.

Had they not given him that previous extension, they may have been backed into a corner. Now, they could even wait until sometime next season before they need to something. That said, I'd imagine they'll cement his status one way or another this coming offseason. I doubt the Giants would go into the season with him on the last year of his deal.

Bleeding Green Nation Philadelphia Eagles Blog

by JasonB on Oct 30, 2007 3:27 PM EDT reply actions

Of course they won't

I just threw the topic out there because it was right at the top of the list when the season started. I wanted to see how much people's opinions had changed with the Giants doing well and TC earning lots of praise. It's obviously a debate that has stirred a good bit of interest. BTW, TC might be safer than Andy Reid.

by Ed Valentine on Oct 30, 2007 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions

If that's so

That he "might be safer than Andy Reid" than it's pretty much a given that Coughlin is safe!

Bleeding Green Nation Philadelphia Eagles Blog

by JasonB on Oct 30, 2007 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions

No way

The team needs to finish strongly, for a change.

by Josh @ Big Blue View on Oct 30, 2007 5:07 PM EDT reply actions

No job is ever that safe

Especially in NY -

Granted, this is the Giants, not the Yankees, but I think we should wait till the end of the season before making any pronouncements.

To win a football game, you have to play the whole 60 minutes, to judge a season, you have to judge the whole season.

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by NYERinSF on Oct 30, 2007 6:21 PM EDT reply actions

Coughlin....

A lot of us, myself included, gave Coughlin a large part of the blame for the way last season ended. Now that the team seems to be more on track it makes sense to give him a large part of the credit for the improvement if we finish strong and make the playoffs.

You want proof he has changed? I watched him near the end of the Dolphins game when we got all those penalties in a row. I was positive he would explode (who would blame him if he had) but he kept it together and so did the team.

by giant fan since 57 on Oct 30, 2007 8:05 PM EDT reply actions

Dying Breed

He has the demeanor of the classic back breaking coach. Through maturity the players respect his ways as like kids who figure out their parents weren't demons. down the road a Coughlin practice camp probably does a lot better than some 'coach who tries to relate to us' mentality.It's coach damnit!

by johnd134 on Oct 30, 2007 8:16 PM EDT reply actions